Photo by Operation Rescue.
Operation Rescue outside Dr. Means' office in Wichita, December 2010.
Ever since Roe v. Wade, the existence of abortion clinics has been considered a victory for women's equality. The downside is that they've also provided a broad, ready target for the anti-abortion movement. Protesters focus their bullying and harassment and violence on the clinics. Legislators craft regulations that put the doctors out of business.
Yesterday in Virginia, Democrats seem to have sleep-walked or fumbled or something'd their way to allowing passage of a bill that says the clinics have to be regulated like hospitals. The New York Times says that could lead to the closure of most of the state's clinics. Some of them are in small offices that would be difficult or impossible to retrofit according to hospital specs. Others of them just don't have the money to deal with a new layer of regulation.
Among the next steps for the pro-choice movement has to be getting abortion services out of full-time abortion clinics and into more general practices. The Guttmacher Institute says that something like one in three American women will choose an abortion by age 45 -- it's part of many, many women's medical histories. It is a medical service, and it shouldn't be relegated to the margins, to a separate category.
Moving abortion services into general practices would make it harder for protesters to target the doctors and the women -- you can't reasonably expect to shutter every doctor in town, nor will the other patients put up with it. And it makes it harder for lawmakers to regulate the service out of existence. Virginia's new bill, which the anti-abortion governor says he'll sign, applies to clinics that perform five or more first-term abortions in a month. You'd more likely find that in a clinic that focuses on abortion, than in a family GP's office that also offers abortions.
And yet. This transition toward family practices including abortions has not been easy on the first doctors willing to make it. We've been following the story of Dr. Mila Means, a family doctors in Wichita, Kansas, who's willing to become the first abortion provider since Dr. George Tiller was murdered in 2009. Because she'd be the first, she has become a target. Her clinic now receives all kinds of patients -- little kids with strep throat, older people in for this or that checkup, and she's not proving abortion. But for the Operation Rescue folks up above, Dr. Means' friendly family practice is now a "proposed new abortion mill" complete with anti-abortion pickets. They're transforming her practice for her, for their own purposes.
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MADISON.com reports a Wisconsin legislator complaining about the protestors in the capitol building:
I guess Rep. Vos has never worked at an abortion services clinic when Operation Rescue is in town.
Thanks for this. I'm just about to blog it.
If the Guttmacher people are correct that one in three women have had an abortion - and there's secrecy in the voting booth - how come anti-choice laws get enacted in all those states? Why does the extreme right prevail in so many battles in Congress on this subject? How is it that abstinence counseling gets funding and sex education gets derided?
I like the way you think!
Part of it is the "my abortion is special" effect. Women who are against abortion in general, but when it comes to her having to make the decision there are 'special circumstances' that make it OK.
Shhhh....it's the hypocrisy of the pseudo Christian repubs.
I recall seeing an article on the "special effect."
It had several circumstances where vigorously pro-life women had abortions. One of them brought in her 16 year old daughter to have an abortion. The next day, they were both right back out there picketing against it.
CWine, you're probably thinking of this article:
"The Only Moral Abortion is My Abortion"
When the Anti-Choice Choose
http://mypage.direct.ca/w/writer/anti-tales.html
Note today.. via Reuters.. Comments at bottom of story as to sentencing of Virginia man for threatening South Park creators for Muslim prophet cartoon.. "His actions caused people throughout the country to fear speaking out - even in jest - to avoid being labeled as enemies who deserved to be killed," Doesn't this sound like the anti abortion crowd?
I consider Operation Rescue to be a terrorist organization.
I feel the same way about Peta and Green Peace
Ugh PETA has never bombed anyone nor have they ever advocated violence. The most they have ever done is stood outside fur companies pouring red paint on themselves like a bunch of weirdos. Green Peace has been accused of a lot of things, but as far as I know they've never been tied directly to anything. I could give you Green Peace, but not PETA. PETA is a bunch of hippies w/ an other-wordly strange affection for their pets. As an interesting side note, PETA is also a racing organization that specializes in car mods. Talk about inconvenient naming.
No, PETA is openly misogynist. Really not a benign organization of smelly animal huggers.
Agreed, MechTrek. PETA is their own worst enemy. In theory I agree with most of what they stand for, but their approach is so denigrating to me as a woman, and it has become so blatant and unapologetic over time, that now I find myself fighting the childish urge to go out of my way to have a meaty dinner every time I see a PETA ad!
If they could stick to just being pro-animal right and promoting a healthy vegetarian lifestyle based on facts, I'd support them wholeheartedly. But since their new mission statement appears to be "Women! The New Meat!" I have really learned to have a negative reaction to them.
Ah well then I apologize ladies. I don't keep up on PETA so I didn't know.
"a bill that says the clinics have to be regulated like hospitals."
Republicans and the Tea Party claim to want to get government "off our backs" by reducing regulation and yet anti-abortion laws and regulations are mushrooming. It's a good thing the Republican/Tea Party base can't think rationally; otherwise, they'd be really angry about this.
Exactly K.G.! Who is going to end up paying for the implementation of all this regulation and the people who have to go out and make sure the clinics are following the regulations? You and me! Watch, this will go viral like the union-busting that is being attempted in several states.
I think it would be great, if someone were to go to the home base of Operation Rescue and start blocking the neighborhoods of Troy Newman (President) and Cheryl Sullenger (Senior Policy Advisor).
They have a survey question on their website today
Asking if Steven C. Bingham's Clinics in multiple states - the states are listed, should be allowed to operate while his license is under suspension.
They give just enough information for people to find out where the clinics are and how to get to them...
I'm no lawyer, but it seems to me that if you require these clinics to follow 'hospital' standards, then it would only be fair to disallow ANY surgery in a doctors office- that doesn't meet hospital standards.
That probably won't happen, but... then again, the BIG HMO's would love to "take out" small private practices.
Oh no... another whole issue.... ARRRRGH !!!
As a "soldier of God", your duty is to keep the peace, and to abide by your God's commandments. Nowhere that I have seen does it say that you must harass those who do not do the same as you do. That is your choice to do so, and your God did not command it. If these people want to "sin" as you see it, look the other way. If murder is your real concern, then why aren't you traveling to the war field where misguided wars are killing many of "God's soldiers" as we speak? Leave these people alone. This is America, we are liberated here.
OK, I'm ignorant of the bible.
But isn't there a place where it implies- "if you aren't saved, then you die".
...or something on those lines. Revelations maybe.
Perhaps the christain conservatives actually believe this drivel and think it's OK as a guideline for persecuting ANYONE who doesn't buy their plan.
Just a guess....
I just need to know where these protesters are when it comes to wars and fully-formed human beings are being killed. Where are their ten commandment signs for them?
On an earlier news post someone commented that for the political hardline Christians, life starts at conception and ends at birth. Whoever said it, it wasn't me, but I think it's a brilliant answer.
Life ends at BIRTH?? Now read what you posted and tell me if it makes any sense....NOT! And just one more thing, are you a man? go figure!
Um... reading comprehension will help you in the world. a) Not my words b) it was intended to be derisive of the anti-abortionists who would refuse children born into poverty basic social security, but applies just as well to the people with "these colors don't run" bumper stickers and c) I'm pro-choice.
A little less outrage next time mmmmmmk?
oh, outrage and screamingly obvious sexism.
Msdonna, if you're still having difficulty, try reading "life" as "protection-deserving life"—as the original writer likely had in mind.
More generally, when you encounter a statement that does not make sense to you, you could try asking yourself, under what interpretation of the words/phrases in this statement might it at least mean something, even if not something you would agree with. If you succeed, then you at least have something concrete to argue against, rather than just sputtering.
Yeah, it bothers me a great deal that the most blood thirsty folks in this country 'seem' to be so-called christains. Odd that these folks love to sacrifice 'other peoples' sons and daughters to fight politically based wars.
Aren't these the same folks who 'threw away' any chance of prolonged benefits for 9/11 firefighters, too ?
Why do christians seem to hate anyone but a fetus ??
You'll never learn. You should fight fire with fire. If the right wing extremist groups who are gathering and protesting at these clinics are photographing doctors and employees of these clinics and posting addresses and other personal information on web sites, you should be taking photographs and collecting personal information on these protestors and posting their information on web sites. See how they like it.
I agree, sometimes the things one must do are distasteful for liberal/progressive sensibilities. But we need to overcome our objections to some of the methods used against us, be creative in developing new ones, and hit the streets and turn the tables on those that would assault women's free exercise of their rights.
If a church preaches hate and discrimination against LGBT persons or in this case actively and physically works against women's reproductive rights, how about sitting in front of their church doors? Interfere with our rights and we will actively inconvenience the exercise of yours.
If anti-abortion protesters were really so concerned about the life of children they would be spending their time attempting to fix the problem instead of outlawing abortion. You may say that pro-lifers spend a lot of time fighting abortion in other ways (which is true), but what you must recognize is that if you outlaw abortion at any point before those other goals are reached you only end up achieving a higher death toll. If the problem is that we don't want the government to sanction mass murder then we must not put our government in a position where it creates more causalities and not less. Please remember outlawing abortion will not make the practice stop.
One has to ask, do they really want it to stop, or just make it Hell on Earth for perceived sinners?
Sometimes I think some of them are hoping it'll be like DADT. They want a law that enables them to both pretend it doesn't exist and also punish anyone for having the gall to remind them that it DOES.
But wouldn't this also drive up the cost of abortion? From the Nat'l Abortion Federation site:
Also, although nearly 2/3s of insurance providers cover abortion to some degree, military insurance only covers it if the woman's life is at risk and Medicaid only has to in cases of rape, incest, or life endangerment (whether they cover other situations is state by state).
So although getting more PCPor OB/GYN offices to offer abortion services conceivably makes it harder for protesters to target abortion providers, it could also serve to limit access to abortion for women who do not have insurance (or whose inusrance policy doesn't cover abortions) or cannot afford the higher cost of the service from a private physician as opposed to a not-for-profit clinic like Planned Parenthood.
Thanks for such a thoughtful counter-argument!
I just happened to be firing on all pistons this morning, Laura. It's a rare occurrence for a Friday :)
I actually DO think that more general practices offering abortion services is a good idea, but like so many things it has to be done in conjunction with other efforts - like getting more comprehensive insurance coverage for reproductive health, and finding ways to make quality health care, in general, more accessible and affordable to all people.
Actually, I disagree a bit here. If more physicians offer abortion services at their practices, the higher cost of the procedure itself would be greatly offset if increased availability reduces the overall cost. Most states have a 24hr waiting period and that makes it a minimum of two days off work just to travel to a clinic and back, nevermind accounting for any recovery time. For instance, a Wichita resident would have at least a 6hr round trip to the nearest abortion provider; complying with the 24hr waiting period would either mean staying overnight in a hotel or making another 6hr round trip, or using about 800mi worth of gas. And that's only IF one has access to a car. Factor in the "hidden" cost of someone else accompanying the patient to the clinic for moral support (and possibly to drive them home afterwards) and you've just doubled the price of everything BUT the actual abortion procedure itself.
That's a really good point, Shannoscubie - but would the 24 hour waiting period still be required at a Dr's office? Because you still have the time taken off of work (and you likely would still want to have someone along for moral support/to drive you home), and you have office fees on top of the cost of the procedure - I know I have to pay $20 anytime I walk through the door of my Dr's office, whether it's for a routine visit, or a strep test or an x-ray or a follow-up appt.
It's true that if you don't have to drive to the next town or the next county or even the next state you're saving money on transportation, but I don't know that the other costs would be reduced that much - unless a PCP could some how get around the waiting period - that's what would really reduce costs!
I don't know why it would be any different. The point of the law (and all the others) is to make having an abortion as difficult as possible. Here is some information the Kansas law, if you're interested. I had a quick look through and it doesn't seem to say anything about whether the type of facility makes any difference.
If my PCP provided them, that'd kick the waiting period right out the window as I'd have gone to see her in the first place for PG testing and an ultrasound - that's no real time off work and it's also covered by health insurance. Hey, there's another way to bring down the price of the actual abortion procedure right there: if the same PCP can provide services that are covered by one's health insurance even if the actual abortion procedure itself is NOT covered.
Again, she's also not 200 miles away. :-P
I just made this its own post.
Laura Conaway
I think you meant to point to here.
Thanks for continuing the discussion!
Wow....thanks Laura!
Back alleys and coat hangers. That's where all this will wind up if GOP terrorist wings get their way.
Okla.republicans have proposed legislation that seeks to define life as begining at conception and ban embryo research. I believe this was pre planned along with the union busting at the repub. goveners meeting before taking office. What else is store for the states?
Someone (Rachel?) needs to do a comprehensive piece on exactly why abortions are performed and why they are often medically necessary. Especially in the case of partial birth abortion which is more correctly a dilation and evacuation (D&E). About 10 yrs ago while working in a hospital (data analyst, not patient care) I worked closely with the Chief of Staff who was also a OBGYN. One day he did a D&E on a patient who had received NO prenatal care and was in serious trouble - fetus not viable. After doing the procedure, the doc was in tears. As he was a very religious man, I thought it was because he was upset about the procedure, but he said NO. He was upset because if the anti-abortionist folks had gotten their way, he would not have been able to save that woman's life. I will never forget that and it made be realize that the rhetoric about abortion is false. There will always be abortions that don't meet the medically necessary test or occur just because the baby isn't wanted, but those will happen even if abortion is made illegal. Too many people think abortion is just about killing babies and that could not be further from the truth. Someone (Rachel)?) needs to shed some light on these real stories about abortion.
Well said. I hate that anti-abortion protesters target women when they're at this moment of vulnerability and fear. It's petty and cruel.
Exactly KayEllen. I really believe in the story about those who are without sin may cast the first stone. Unless someone finds themselves in a bad situation they have no right to criticize anyone else. To make matters worse women are called murderers after going thru. a very traumatic and emotionally painful event like abortion. Where are their Christian values in doing that??? Where's the compassion!
7.2 Madonna
Actually it's quite a brilliant quip. Where are anti-abortion protesters when the children they've "saved" need food, shelter, health care, clothing, education, etc? Still outside an abortion clinic yelling at distraught women and dedicated professionals, that's where. Other peoples' lives truly do end at birth for many of those folks.
Note that if you were to click on either of the Reply buttons inside the grey rectangle containing Msdonna's comment, your response would appear in that same rectangle rather than seven threads further down the page.
My apologies if you already knew that but accidentally hit the wrong button.
Our rights are eroding away so fast it looks like the Taliban has moved in. On the bright side there will be more jobs, pregnancy police! Every state could hire thousands. They could pop out from under every bedroom in America to protect the rights of sperm and ova! You all know I'm being sarcastic.
News: Maybe not - how else will these radicals be able to make sure each fetus goes to term?
GA Rep. Seeks to Criminalize Unauthorized Vaginal Bleeding
Lindsay Beyerstein on February 23, 2011, 6:25 PM
http://bigthink.com/ideas/31348
Apparently this representative introduces some sort of anti-abortion legislation just about every year, but he's covering new ground here.
As a pro-life liberal, I have to say I'm disturbed by the characterization of all anti-abortion protests as "bullying and harassment and violence." Some, in fact, are peaceful groups. One church in a town not far from where I live has a group of people who merely stand near a local clinic with signs and take an occasional break to pray. They stay within the law, don't tread onto private property and never scream at, shout down, or harass anyone who goes into the building.
While I, personally, have never felt compelled to join in any such protest, I think it's more than slightly hyperbolic to paint every person who feels lead to defend the rights of the unborn and stand outside an abortion clinic as the same radicals who are part of Operation Rescue.
What disturbs me from the pro-life side is that no one talks about working to prevent the pregnancies that lead to abortion. It's the all too typical, reactionary idea of just make it illegal and that will stop people from doing it.
In 2005, then-Senator Hillary Clinton said, "There is no reason why government cannot do more to educate and inform and provide assistance so that the choice guaranteed under our constitution either does not ever have to be exercised or only in very rare circumstances." I would take it a step further and say that there is no reason why the Church cannot do the same thing.
If you're trying to stop women from having an abortion at the door of a clinic, you're too late. It seems a much better effort to be a resource in our communities by providing financial assistance, education (something more than abstenance-only) and guidance while at the same time condemning those who claim to stand for love, peace, and life but use the tools of fear and intimidation.
To be fair I think this is where a lot of people get angry. What about the rights of the born?
This is the exact same position that pro-choicers take. If you say you do not believe abortion should be outlawed you are pro-choice. No one is pro-abortion.
Mickey, I think your first point is fair. All I'm trying to say is that I don't think the majority of people who protest outside of an abortion clinic do it with the subjugation of women as their primary focus.
As for the second point, you can label me however you want.
Aaron, I agree with everything you've said here. I work with an organization that's doing exactly the kind of work you say pro-lifers should be doing. Click my profile and contact me if you want more information.
"a group of people who merely stand near a local clinic with signs and take an occasional break to pray."
Sorry, Aaron, but standing near a local clinic with signs is not acceptable to me either. Do they know why the procedures they are protesting are happening? Are they praying for the woman who may be there not by choice but by necessity? - who may be there on a matter of HER life or death? These people should be advocating for the reduction of unplanned pregnancies, NOT carrying signs protesting what they know nothing about. I suspect these are the same people who are in favor of defunding Planned Parenthood which is an organization that tries to prevent unplanned pregnancies which is what they should be in favor of. In order to perform a late term abortion, these clinics have to have proof of medical necessity. A legitimate clinic ONLY performs abortions allowed by law and should not be the target of ANY protest. Protest the lawmakers if you have a problem with this law.
Especially not when they're like the ones out last Friday in front of a property Dr. Mila Means purportedly has been looking at to move her practice to in Wichita. They were holding up huge, graphic, full-color pictures of mangled fetuses.
I wasn't meaning to label you Aaron, my apologies that's not how I meant it. I believe people have a huge misconception about what it means to be pro-life or pro-choice because of how both movements have been messaged and organized. To say you are pro-choice simply means you believe abortion should be legal; to say you are pro-life simply means you do not believe abortion should be legal. What you are describing- as far as taking that more middle road- actually isn't represented by either "pro-life" or "pro-choice" in the most technical of ways. And that's all I was trying to get at.
I would think, as a society, we could agree that mass murder is never OK. And as such I would think we could agree that whenever we are faced with such moral questions we would take those questions seriously. If outlawing abortion will not end the practice and may in fact increase the risk of death we are not valuing life and are therefore are contradicting our own moral code. If we know ABC education is the most effective tool to ward against unwanted pregnancies, if we know adequate access to health facilities can avert unwanted pregnancies or treat pregnancies that may (if left untreated) prove fatal to mother or infant, if we know poverty drives most abortions, if we know spiritual and community leadership is necessary to encourage people to use adequate protection and judgement, then you would think our society would take on these challenges and put as much fervor into them as they would protesting outside of an abortion clinic. Sadly this is not the case.
Well put. I might add that the pro-life folks rarely seem to line-up to adopt either.
Most of my points have already been said beautifully, but I do have one thing to add, and it's about Aaron's observation that pro-life groups rarely if ever promote sex education and contraception use. I think this is so because it is often true that these pro-life groups and activists have broader fundamentalist views that reach beyond abortion. Often it's not just about abortion, it's also about enforcing strict controls on sexuality, especially female sexuality, and promoting the view that everyone should strive to be chaste, heterosexual, married, God-fearing, and fertile. You don't need contraception if you both wait until marriage and expect to have a child right away. You especially don't need it if you intend to have as many children as "God gives you". This isn't to say that all people who identify as pro-life feel this way, but that the anti-choice movement as a whole tends to have regressive views on sex, sexuality, and gender.
Take my school, for example. We had a pro-life club, led by our Chaplain. They loved to talk about babies and fetuses and they went to Ottawa's "march for life" and held a "pro-life week" in our main foyer so that we would have to walk past plastic fetuses and commercials that talked about how "3 million children have gone missing" if we wanted to eat lunch. But it's also a Catholic school. This meant that things that prevent pregnancy and abortion, like sex and contraception education, were never discussed. You would think that if they cared about fetuses so much, they would care about educating people so that they don't end up with fetuses they don't want. But that's the thing; it's not just about the fetuses. It's about adherence to a broader religious doctrine that is so "pro-life" that it wants women to have as many children as "God gives you", and to never interfere with His wishes through things like contraception. And don't even think about having sex with someone other than your husband.
Well said, Girl!!!
I don't understand pro-life protesters at all. They usually are protesting abortion on religious grounds, but don't they believe that God is all powerful? If God wanted a child to be born then it would be born. Are they saying that mere humans can circumvent God's plan? Also, don't most religions believe in free will? If you believe that each individual has the free will to make choices about how to live his/her life then how can you justify denying someone this choice?
It's all b.s. The "believers" are just mutually supporting each other's insecurities about religion their faith, etc. It has nothing to do with God. It's just a giant support group of fearful people who think that they are doing God's work. They would be better off with less praying and more compassion for the living.
If the left wing is really so violent as Glenn Beck says, then how come Operation Rescue buildings or "pro-life" protesters have never been targeted for a domestic terrorist attack? Could it be that a liberal's first response to outrage isn't to pick up a gun or make a bomb like certain elements on the right? Just saying.
From the grand jury report on Kermit Gosnell's Pennsylvania abortion clinic:
The grand jury report specifically recommended that abortion clinics should be regulated as ambulatory surgical facilities.
I'm the first to agree that Republicans have a fetish for proposing laws that make them look "tough on abortion" rather than actually doing any good for women and unborn children. But the debate about this law should be about whether it is medically appropriate, not about the politics.
What went on at Gosnell's is a result of so many clinics being forced to close (85% counties in the US have no abortion services). His clients were largely poor women and recent immigrants who barely spoke English and had neither the money nor often times the information to go somewhere else. And people had actually been filing complaints against his practice that were never investigated.
If you have a law in a state that has already tried to make it very difficult for women to gain access to abortion that is going to result in the majority of clinics shutting down, that law is not about protecting women, that law is about using all the loopholes you can to restrict access to a legal medical procedure.
Check out the Safe Abortion Project. It's aimed at showing that the majority of clinics offering abortion services are dedicated to offering safe health care services. Gosnell is in the minority...it's kinda like comparing all anti-abortion folks to people like Scott Roeder.
Check out
That's a great project!
Too late and too predictable. Why so surprised? What are the figures in the legislatures? Mostly men, mostly white and now mostly purchased lock, stock, and barrel by wacko-far fringe, confused and propagandized by even further far right zealots. We don't have to worry about despotic Sharia law, we are going to get far right Fake Christian Law. Like Beck and Limbaugh say - some Christianity that most people don't recognize. Bet Jesus wouldn't recognize it either. He did mention something about charity being all important - more important than anything else. Ah well. Back to the 13th century!
Generally I agree with you, but the 14th century was really bad. See Barbara W. Tuchman's A Distant Mirror: The Calamitious 14th Century.
That was such a GOOD book! But I have to agree with Charles we are going backwards instead of forward- hopefully not too far back tho. As for Jesus- he wouldn't recognize himself in their words and actions.
I have no doubt that Rabbi Yeshua ben Yosef would be appalled at most of the things that have been done in his (altered) name.
Sad, now we have the Glenn Beck Jesus! Can it get any worse????????????????????????????????????????????????????
The Glenn Beck Jesus? I'm not sure what using the most likely name of the person who was turned into Jesus by the early Christians has to do with Glenn Beck.
Well, Jesus has had many incarnations. The real Jesus, who ever he was or whatever he was called, is just a mystery. In the middle ages Jesus was the Torquemada Jesus, there is the Lily of the Valley Jesus, there is the gentle Jesus, there is the rebel Jesus, there is the Christian right-wing Jesus, there is the Catholic Jesus and on and on it goes.
Now the radical Christian right has assumed control of Jesus. Glenn Beck and company have usurped his name- hence the Glenn Beck Jesus. It's as clear as mud, yes?
And THAT'S rich as the Beckster is a Mormon! Mormon Theology teaches that God is only one of countless gods, and is not considered a "Christian" religion.
Well here we are way off topic but..
Morman or not the religious right is now the new face of Jesus!
I'm not emotionally invested in the issue, but technically the Mormons are not Christians precisely because of the believing in many gods thing. I believe the technical term for believing in many gods but worshipping one specific god is "henotheism".
No matter how you slice it and dice it, I feel sorry for Jesus, Yeshua, as he has been taken over by the right wing!
The same with God or Gods; someone always thinks God is on their side and hates the other! I resent people who use a divine concept as a political tool!
God on their side? Hey, Dylan wrote a song about that too:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTtVTNTfg80
A quick search didn't show a clip of Dylan himself singing it.
Abortion is legal, regardless of what somebody's moral opinion is on it. And Rachel Maddow reported, what, only 13% of counties in the USA provide this service?? Maybe I am not quoting the right statistic--- and this is for something that is legal??? And now--- to learn-- that all those protests in Kansas were not representative of the communities of Kansas-- but a threatening, stalking, dangerious mission by Operation Rescue? This should have been stopped a long time ago-- before Dr. Tiller was murdered.
If you close down Planned Parenthood-- we will go back to women performing their own abortions, in the back ally's, probably almost killing themselves in the process by getting an infection--- like what was done before Roe vs. Wade. And every woman who is financially vulnerable or does not have medical insurance will be the one's to suffer if Planned Parenthood is closed down. Limiting Federal funds or other funds to Planned Parenthood would result in this.
But, I liked what Rachel Maddow's guest, I think her last name was Gaines? said-- that any verbal, actual threats, stalking, posting posters, or cyber stalking/ bullying should be arrested. Those protesting, if linked to these activities, should be arrested. (As in Dr. Tiller's situation, the stalking/ harassment led to his murder) I think this would be the first step in stopping the harassment and intimidation that is going on.
Diana B
As far as the bill proposing to make all abortion clinics run like "operating rooms" under the approval of "JCACHO"--- probably most likely a tactic for most clinics to shut down, because they cannot afford to keep up and provide services under regulation, and allow them to be "credited".
I think someone should investigate and do a project on the percentage of unsafe outcomes or-- the percentage of a negative impact on the safety of the woman at the abortion clinics. hmmmm--- maybe I should?? I would think, if the percentage is low-- is there really a need to enforce this? Safety or promoting healthy well being of the woman would be the only incentive to regulate abortion clinics, I would think
Diana B
DianaB -- your posts make such good sense, thank you! However, common sense is not something the anti-abortionists are familiar with. They don't or won't see the obvious.
Isn't the methods they use, (intimidation, following Doctors home and publishing their address) a kind of stalking? There are anti-stalking laws which should be enforced against these rabid people, I would think.
My guess would be that the percentage would be no higher than those of a hospital.
What? You say hospitals have unsafe outcomes? YES! And still they receive JCAHO accreditation. While it would be unfortunate should the clinics have to shut down, I foresee the services being provided in GP offices as a matter of course and avoiding the stigma of being known as an "abortion provider". Most GPs have large enough client bases, that taking on pro-bono cases periodically would not hurt their bottom line. Unless, of course, they are Republican GPs.... then it's a whole 'nother issue.
I really believe that the greatest threat to the United States is the right wing! They seem to be pathological liars and they don't care how many people they harm in all of their dealings. It appears that most of them think that the Magna Carta was a way to liberal document. After they outlaw abortions and take away all parent planning clinics will they then move to revoke women's right to vote? Some one has already talked about requiring only land owners being allowed to vote. I sincerely hope that the American public will see this horrific attack on all of our liberties and stop them by putting them out of office.
Bill, I couldn't agree more! They are as sneaky and dangerous and vile as can be, IMO.
However, sadly, there are a great many average citizens who will vote them into office anyway, because they know they can count on the votes of the uninformed, biased, and undereducated masses they court.
"THOU SHALT NOT KILL"
perfectly alright, however, for us to do so, because, you know, we're doing it for God (and we can commit whatever sin we want besides because we're forgiven as Christians).
or maybe they intended the double-negative and expect everyone else to dismiss it.
Separating women's reproductive health services apart from the normal delivery systems for health care was simply painting a target onto the sides of any building trying to help women. There are no "abortion clinics" in Europe, etc. That would be like making vasectomies only available in certain buildings. Stupid.
Well said.
Actually, there are abortion clinics in europe (check out info on one of the orgs in the UK). Just like Planned Parenthood they offer a wide range of reproductive health services.