When the Wall Street Journal is able to publish an op-ed titled "Union busting, Massachusetts style," you know Democrats are blowing it. The state House, where Democrats have a strong majority, has passed a bill that would curb collective bargaining over health benefits for municipal employees. The Democratic governor says he won't sign a "Wisconsin-type bill," but the difference might be more a matter of degree than kind.
Republican governors have suffered big losses in public opinion polls this year, in large because of their attempts to bust the unions. Why on earth would Democrats want a part of that, Rachel asked last night.
"They say that Democrats are really good at snatching defeat from the jaws of victory," she said. "They say that the only extreme gun laws Democrats always support is the right to shoot themselves in their own foot. They say the Democrats have never seen a political opportunity they either didn't reject or turned inside out so they could figure out if you'd make them lose instead of win."
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Yeah, as a resident of Massachusetts, I got nothing. They're certainly getting taken to task here for it.
How on earth can those guys be so absolutely dim on this subject? Are they living in a bubble? Have they not seen what has been happening in WI, OH and other places?
When I saw the headline this morning, I thought it was a misprint. There are days you just can't dance the Whiskey Tango Foxtrot fast enough...
I'm not sure what they are up to. It's not as if the repubs are even a factor in the legislature or in the state as a whole, so they don't have to worry about getting tossed out in November. They remind me of Lieberman, always jumping to the wrong party at just the wrong time.
I hear their next move is to repeal voting rights for women and minorities.
Democrats Bitch.
Democrats Blame.
Democrats don't show up:
They complain.
-- H.R. Haldeman (attributed)
I find your ignorance very amusing. To think that it's just Democrats who "bitch, blame and complain" you need only see footage of Boehner, Canter, McConnel, and Ryan talk about the current state of affairs. I've never seen so much crying in my life! Which cave are you in?
Apparently, Pedro, the reference to H.R. Haldeman was lost on you. It should not be. His attitude, combined (and finding its source in LBJ's observation in 1964 that the South was gone for a generation because of the Civil Rights Ac of 1964) and his profession as an Ad Man generated Nixon's "Southern Strategy". It also led Erlichman to begin his War on Drugs: "We cannot outlaw being young or being black or being homos, but we can outlaw the theings they enjoy." And it led directly to Donald Segretti, and Liddy, and, by extension, Limabugh, Ryan et alia.
Look, I would suggest, at the amount of $$ spent in the Massachusetts General Court to achieve this vote. Look as well to the "information" provided to the members. Slicker 'n owl spit all of it.
They bring a knife. We bring a book. Worse, we fail, have failed, and continue to fail to take them at their word. They, however, know exactly what we will do. Rachel has been saying it.
To put this in military terms,. They have successfully mounted an attack in our rear; in our base. It shall not carry the field as Gov. Patrick has said he will not sign such a bill, but it is a warning. Even Rachel, a resident of the Commonwealth, apparently, did not see it coming. Her, and our attention, was focused elsewhere.
Money has no party. It may be and is employed by all. I ask you review what she pointed out about the spending on the Ryan Bill fallout. We, and it mystifies me why we do not, just don't get it.
Again, they bring a knife. We bring a book.
Could they be intentionally creating bad law so they can overturn it in court to create a useful legal precedent in a friendly state supreme court?
Now that's a classic example of grabbing for straws. I hope you don't really believe that.
"Don't Raise The Bridge, Lower The River" - appropriately enough, a Jerry Lewis movie.
Ain't that just the way? Democrats finally get a taste for blood and proceed to chew off their own foot.
Massachusetts voters elected Republican Scott Brown to replace Edward Kennedy and eliminated the "supermajority" of Democrats in the Senate.
I still wonder what was going through their heads.
Stockholm Syndrome.
Maybe Rachel can invite them to the show to explain. This has to be something other than stupidity.
Yea give the Republicans some more AMMO to use against the Dems
There are few if any real Democrats left... the vast majority are DINOs... who would have been moderate Republicans 20 yrs ago. This insanity is easily understood considering the control that the Oligarchy now wields without any hesitation or embarassment.
At the heart of this issue is municipal employee health insurance costs which continue to rise at a ridiculous rate and comprise more of every city/town's budget each year, percentage-wise. The unions aren't budging on their coverage levels so the legislature wants to take that bargaining away, put them on the state employee plan, and save $100m/year. No one's happy here. Solutions welcomed.
Let the union members go with which ever deal...the union benefits vs state employee benefits. If they are expected to sacrifice, there must be some form of compensation.
The solution is for the state to determine the total compensation (pay and benefits) available, then ask the state employees' union to decide how they want to allocate that amount among the various categories. If the employees want to go all in on health care, they have to give up something on pay or other benefits.
Given the unlimited upside of health care costs, it's not irrational for workers to want to be protected there--even at the expense of wage cuts or reductions in some other benefits.
As long as for-profit insurance companies have their fingers in the pie, we will continue to have to make that false choice. Go to a single payer system, and/or require insurance companies to be non-profits, as they were up until Nixon, and you will see an end to healthcare costs that increase faster than inflation.
@Uffdaguy, I did not know that about US insurance companies. Can you recommend some references for more in-depth reading?
Rachel should mention that her State Representative, Paul Mark of the 2nd Berkshire District, stood with labor on this vote. Invite him on the show!
Because this is only with regard to health care, is it possible that negotiations regarding health care are going to be at odds with federal mandates? Or with Massachusetts' health care plan? I haven't researched the legal issues, but that was the first thing that came to my mind.
Does Rachel ever ask WHY Democrats always cave, even when it is seemingly to their political disadvantage? How about because they are just as sold out to corporate interests as Republicans?
It sure seems so sometimes. But Uffdaguy has the right idea. Take the extreme profit out of health care and health insurance.
I haven't noticed Obama taking the profit out of health care. Medicare for all would have done that. But that was off the table, because Obama is a total sellout to the insurance companies, to the banks, to Wall Street, to the Military/Industrial complex and to the Devil, as far as I'm concerned.
Word.
Wow, it is true, the Democrats can be so damn stupid. They should be out impaling these republiturds and planting them on the lawn, but instead they are being nice to them. It really pisses me off, they basically lay down and invite them to wipe the dog @!$%# off on them like a door mat. The sad thing is that many of the democrats are also taking corporate money which is something that really needs to be removed from the system to have a real government "of the people". GE, BP, Exxon, Chase, Bank of America are NOT PEOPLE.. that disgusting supreme court decision, talk about the most horrible corporate supreme court we have ever had in our history.
The fundamental issue is health care costs. The current system allows unchecked greed to run the system.
The municipal employees are the scape goats. Atack them by gutting the unions and the problem is solved.
Unfortunately the dems bought into the GOP play book. The real solution is to follow the money. Who is making the most money in the current health care system?
Just maybe this Dem are blue dog.
Voters, Pay attention to whom you vote for. If you are middle class or minority, elderly (65) over, the Republican have big business and big oil in mind, not ours. do not have your best interest in mind. Put away your bias and vote what is best for you and your country. It behooves me as to why anyone in this group would vote Republican. Yes, we need to balance the budget. We can't go one like this. I'm not a politician or pundit but here is what we need to do: 1. Abolish the so-called temporary tax decrease for millioniers and billioniers. 2. Abolish the oil subsidies for large oil company. 3. Put an additional tax on any company that moves it's operation overseas. Enough of this. China will surpass the US in about four years. We cannot affford to have our workers unemployed just so the big shorts can get cheap labor and increase their profits. I would be glad to pay a little more just to keep America working. 4. Make medicare work be eliminating all te fraud. This seems to be an easy task. Hire people to investigate the fraud. It looks like the America is so easy scamed. Ex. how can monthly payment be made to doctors for services that do not exist. They should eliminate sending checks to Post Office's. There should be a valid list of ligitimate doctors and pharmacies. If we don't pay attention America will lose it's middle class and have only millioniers and billioniers and the working poor us.
What the Massachusetts House Dems have done is provide cover for the Republicans in every state in the 2012 elections. Because of this one stupid move, Republicans will simply be able to say, "How can you accuse US of being the "anti-union" party? Both parties are curtailing union rights. Just look at Massachusetts."
What a stupid thing this was to do. Never put it past the Democrats to take full advantage of an opportunity to miss an opportunity.
Oh please, say it's not so...Only in the state of mass....
they all live in a bubble that exist at least two years in the past? what's goin on in this state? first a gop senator and now a chick-n-@!$%# democratic party. it must be promises of a lifetime job after they lose their seat.
I had asked this very same thing under a Walker blog...WHERE ARE OUR FEDERAL REPRESENTATIVES AND SENATORS...WHY ARE THEY NOT HERE IN OUR STATE SPEAKING OUT ON ALL OF THESE TEA PARTY REPUBLICANS over reaching and destroying our state....why are they absent....WHY ISN'T THE PRESIDENT HERE SPEAKING OUT ON THIS...I know he has alot on his plate, but alot is at stake in these states...he's has spoken out on it but not near enough or loud enough.....Our states are in desperate straits, we are being taken apart piece by piece...there's even more legislation being considered in our state and putting the union busting bill back into the new financial budget due in June in our state of WI.....even though the original union busting bill is still in the court system....there's rumors also going around that Walker is quietly starting Martial Law type over reach financially, and Milwaukee looks to be first as there's prime real estate on the Lake to be sold, of course, Walker was the one that financially put Milwaukee in the economic state of being in dire straits d/t Walker's mismangement when he was the County Executive, ....the rumor that goes along with this of course is that he wouldn't be able to be recalled while the state would be under Martial Law....I don't have proof of this but just the talk that's occurring on the blogs, but am sure with your resources would be able to find these facts out.....he also is trying to get a voter ID law in place severely limiting ppl to vote due to having to have a picture ID and having ppl checking signatures slowing up lines making ppl tired of waiting and would leave, making it extremely difficult for students, the poor, minorities, elderly and disabled the most....there's a term for this for which escapes me right now but I thought it was illegal to do this and there's a name for this and I hope someone comes through on this...they're planning on doing this by the time of the elections...they're also trying to set a same date for all of the recalls for July, of course, after the state budget to be voted on in June...which is beyond he dates that some of them should be able to take place, like Kapanke as he was the first one recalled and should be able to vote on him in June d/t the 31 days signature check, but they will be asking for an extension I'm sure d/t the amount of recalls, 6 reps so far, 2 dems I believe....don't think those will go anywhere as it was paid out of town ppl that collected those sigs and we know those will be challenged d/t the way some sigs were collected....by ppl shots to sign, felon collecting sigs and was arrested for theft in Green Bay, ppl collecting sigs and telling ppl that it was a petition to keep the dem in office but in reality was a petition recalling that dem....OUR STATE IS IN NEED OF HELP....as is the other states that are under similar attacks by billionaire backed Tea Baggers that have unlimited funds that have bought and paid for these ppl....PPL NEED TO WAKE UP BEFORE IT HAPPENS TO YOUR STATE...these billionaire's plans are to overtake this country on the state and federal level...and if ppl don't wake up soon it will be too late.....ESPECIALLY PPL IN THE SOUTH THAT SEEM APATHETIC AND JUST DON'T SEEM TO HAVE THE FIGHT IN THEM...and just accept their fate and that their faith will see them through....these T Baggers will use any means and lies necessary to get themselves into office......whatever these T baggers say expect the exact opposite to occur because that's what happened in approx 12 other states controlled by these T Baggers.....The REGULAR GOP needs to wake up and fight against this radical right also......WHY DON'T THESE POLITICIANS HAVE THE BALLS TO STAND UP FOR THE PPL THAT ELECTED THEM INTO OFFICE....thanks for letting me question and rant for what's happening to our states and country...
Why should the Unions give up anything? Why should the working class give up anything? Why should the elderly give up anything? Big business and Wall Street created this disaster, let them clean it up with their record producing profits. Corporations create all of this chaos about Unions, Medicare, Healthcare, Charlie Sheen, you name it, just to deflect from the fact that they are publicly robbing the middle and working class. Unemployment can be good for Corporations. It drives wages into the ground....Will work for food!!!
After this news broke the other day, I spent some time trying to track down the bill, in part to find out which way my (usually reliable) rep voted.
Since I didn't have the time and energy to read through all of the interlocking hunks of budget, what follows here is only my guess, but I'm pretty confident that I'm in the ballpark.
As a cost-cutting move, the state is setting things up so that municipal employee health insurance can be provided through the state. My impression is that a union can opt out up front, but once they opt in, they are in forever. And if they opt in, they lose the right to negotiate over health care benefits.
As I say, I may not have this quite right. If this is the case, then it isn't quite so nasty as I first imagined. I'm not saying I like it, but isn't quite the same as completely abrogating negotiation rights and eviscerating the unions a la Wisconsin.
You're absolutely right. This allows small towns like ours to save a lot of money that can then go to education, the local library, senior services, etc. The state health care system in Massachusetts is hardly a bad deal. We have a "Town Hall" system of government in our town and we all debate the budget and then vote on it. You can bet the savings will go directly to restoring a lot of services, especially for our schools.
The Unions should have taken this deal when it was offered to them, rather than holding out the way they have. They overplayed their hand and are now crying foul.
Never ever did I think I would live to see the day that Governor Wallace's contention would prove to be true when he observed," There's not a dime's worth of difference between the Republicans and Democrats."
But the Democrats in Massachusetts House are proving him correct.
Never did I think I would live to see the day that Governor Wallace's contention about the two political parties would prove to be true when he observed," There's not a dime's worth of difference between the Republicans and Democrats."
But the Democrats in the Massachusetts House are proving him correct