On Friday, Mitt Romney argued policymakers can "help the American people" by laying off, not just public-sector workers in general, but specifically school teachers, police officers, and firefighters. The call for more public-sector austerity was immediately welcomed by President Obama's re-election team.
Any chance the Romney camp might walk this back? Apparently not -- former New Hampshire Gov. John Sununu (R), a leading Romney surrogate, talked to MSNBC's Chris Jansing this morning, doubling down on the pro-layoffs line. Sununu said "people ought to stop jumping on it as a gaffe" -- he's right; this was a policy position, not a gaffe -- but added that Romney's position is "wise."
The whole thing is worth watching, but Sununu's pitch effectively came to this: layoff for teachers and first responders is a good thing, because in some parts of the country, the population is shrinking. Or as he specifically put it, "If there's fewer kids in the classrooms, the taxpayers really do want to hear there will be fewer teachers."
As spin goes, this is pretty weak. Romney wasn't talking about population shifts; he was talking about the size of government. The Republican nominee specifically told supporters, "[Obama] wants to hire more government workers. He says we need more fireman, more policeman, more teachers. Did he not get the message of Wisconsin? The American people did. It's time for us to cut back on government and help the American people."
He didn't say "cut back on government" in areas based on trends in Census data.
For that matter, Sununu doesn't know what he's talking about. Teachers and first responders aren't being forced from their jobs because of shrinking populations; they're unemployed because state and local governments are broke. The result are more struggling schools and less public safety. This, in turn, is bad those who get laid off, bad for the communities they serve, and bad for the economy as these folks scale back.
But then there's that other part of Sununu's argument: what "taxpayers really do want to hear."
We talked earlier about a poll gauging public attitudes on this, but Greg Sargent tracked down some additional data that's worth keeping in mind.
Way back in the mists of ancient history, when Obama proposed the American Jobs Act, pollsters took the judicious step of polling its individual provisions. The relevant findings:
* A CNN poll in October of 2011 found that 75 percent of Americans supported “providing federal money to state governments to allow them to hire teachers and first responders,” including 72 percent of independents.
* A New York Times/CBS poll in September of 2011 found that 52 percent, and 51 percent of independents, think it’s a “good idea” to “provide money to state governments to avoid layoffs.”
* A National Journal poll at around the same time found that 70 percent thought “providing funds to state and local governments to prevent layoffs of teachers, police officers, and other first responders” would be “very effective” or “somewhat effective” in creating more jobs.
At least as of last fall, what Romney believes would "help the American people" and the American people believe would help the American people are two very different things.
Senate Republicans killed this provision of the American Jobs Act last year with a filibuster, but Obama adviser Stephanie Cutter suggested this morning that the Senate schedule another vote on this, which could help crystalize the larger economic debate. Indeed, the argument itself could be incredibly instructive for voters -- Romney could explain why he thinks the country would benefit from more layoffs, and Obama could explain why he believes the opposite.
No word yet from Senate Democrats about whether we can expect another vote.
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I wonder how Mr. Sununu would feel if after he was car-jacked and called the police he got the following message: "sorry, due to lay-offs we're prioritizing crime please listen closely and press the button indicted:
for murder homicide press 1
for rape press 2
for all other crimes press 3, oops sorry that mailbox is full, please call back later.
I think he'd change his mind then.....
How about we cut sununus' pay ,or lay him off 1st, as an example of him and romneys wonderful austerity plan ?
Hey Gov, how exactly does laying off more people create jobs?
It works to provide the job creators with more spending money to increase demand for goods and services in amercia. Durdt!
FTFY...
"how exactly does laying off unnecessary public employees create jobs?"
and, really, it's fairly easy to understand. in places where there are unnecessary public employees like associate assistant outreach director for special services and other vital public union-padding crap like that (not necessarily the heartstring-tugging teachers, cops and firemen), the taxes collected goes down, the private sector has more money to invest, and more private sector employees are hired.
no one who is serious about this wants to fire cops, firemen and teachers who are needed and competent. assuming otherwise based on silly assumptions adds nothing to the debate.
When does he say that he is going to eliminate unnecessary jobs? I keep asking, and I have yet to get an answer. You are putting words in his mouth because you want to believe that he is talking about unnecessary jobs, and bad employees. That is not what he is saying or even implying. I wish that is what he meant, but it isn't.
Its not really that simple after all...the relative savings for any one business by lowering the tax collected by some nominal amount is simply insufficient to justify hiring. Further, you failed to explain how firing a wage earner leads to increased demand, a necessary ingredient that must precede hiring.
I am all ears.
And the suddenly laid-off public employees helps economic demand how exactly? I'm sure the lower demand for goods and services due to these folks not having an income will do wonders for private sector job growth.
you see how they're trying to cleave teachers away from fire and policemen.
uh huh
uh huh
Romney is the gift that keeps on giving. This is another Romney statement which like his ad about the auto bailout is not explained away with nuance. The ad can link this statement with Romney's statement about firing people.
To me, the most amusing aspect to election season is the spin and one liners taken out of context. Romney never said he would fire teachers, etc. Mentioning Wisconsin alludes to retaining workers but finding different ways to pay them rather than raise taxes. The context within Romney said he likes to "fire People" is never mentioned. And on auto, he advocated bankruptcy, not the convoluted bankruptcy the govt concocted.
You just can't keep throwing money at local govt to add hires without addresssing one of the fundamental problems facted by them - unsustainable benefit costs. That's what Wisconsin did.
I think the GOP is trying to appeal to their base: all those people who did poorly in school and hated their teachers. Got to be the only explanation.
Or else they are counting on the aging population and the hatred of brown folk.
I recall when Prop. 13 in California cut all the 'frivolous' programs like art and music for elementary school students the parents in my town demanded a meeting with the state representative to discuss what we as parents could do, the answer being, of course, nothing.
He said that the people were just not going to pay for public education because the the number of children was declining. I said that that couldn't be true given the millions of children in the state.
His response was, "You're right. The children aren't becoming fewer, but they're becoming browner, and no one wants to pay for THEIR education."
Ya' all are missing the point . Their mission is to eliminate public employees completely and have them replaced by hourly workers so that a corporation can make a profit . Why pay firefighters, police and teachers all that money when one of our
serfser um employees can do it for $10 an hour . Once the unions are outlawed the permanent underclass will be scrambling for those jobs just to feed their families . When the middle class is eliminated we can make some real money.And I wish I was joking.
"Their mission is to eliminate public employees completely"
does this mean the left's mission is to eliminate private employees completely?
aren't both positions laughably hyperbolic and add zero to an informed debate? I think so.
How did you extrapolate that from what I said?
There are certain functions that are better served by "public employees" .
I am sick of public employees being classified as not real jobs , like when they spend their money
Didn't you hear Scott walker - Divide and conquer.
They get people to ask the wrong questions.
Why do public employees get benefits, instead of
Why does this multi billion dollar corporation make so much money and return none of it to the employes in the form of benefits. Why does my employer treat me like sh*t
Raise your hand-joe 2582195- if you think "Private" prisons are a better use of our tax dollars than ones run by the state. It is, after all, part of the "Service Economy".
Nobody should be laying off anybody in this economy. Whether you live in a populated area or not, they should be transferring the teachers, firemen and policemen to different areas if there is less need. Not firing them, they are people like you and me who probably have children to feed. Before they start firing people , something which Romney loves to do, they should take a big cut in their own pay. Wasn't it recently that romney was making a speech with all the Village People behind him wearing hats like nurses hats and cowboy hats? What happened to that approach? I was almost on the floor laughing at that hysterically. I think everybody should go around wearing hats....the Occupy Movement should start wearing their professional job hats too. I'm going to don my Lucille Ball hat, the one with the feather.
As soon as a private corporation takes over the prisons (including the personnel) the economy takes a big jump because of the Wonders of Private Enterprise. Where before the State was running a money pit, now it's a lean, mean, incarceration machine that inspires everyone in the State to go out and start their own business with money they wheedle out of their parents.
We learned this when the DOD put Halliburton in charge of logistics and our troops instantly became immune to IEDs (the spandex underwear may have had something to do with it, too.)
And if you think private prisons are good, you should see what happens when your school district is dissolved and handed over to a bunch of nuns.
"Sununu's pitch effectively came to this: layoff for teachers and first responders is a good thing, because in some parts of the country, the population is shrinking."
how does this not make sense?
oh, I see. after reading the tea leaves and diving what he REALLY meant....got it.
They want to decrease the surplus population even further? So, he was putting forth a plan or he was letting his rich buddies know what the big plan is. They could always start another war that served them well in the area of surplus population. Send the army up a few more hills and see how many survive. That's why their own sons are exempt from the wars. That's why Romney didn't serve, his Daddy knew exactly what was going on. They really need another solution besides killing innocent human beings. God knows which wars are real and which ones are made up. That's one thing they're gonna have a hard time explaining on judgement day.
Sunununu just admitted to holding the working class hostage. Investors are holding on to their money as long as Obama is President.
We knew this already but he actually said it like it's a good thing.
Nevermind.
How can Romney cite the Wisc.recall? Walker won by somewhere around 170,000 votes out of 4.5 million cast, or seven percentage point's.Not exactly the landslide republicans make it out to be.The vote was not so much for Walker as it was voters were against recalling him for insufficient measures,and being tired of recalls.You could tell that by the exit polls that gave Pres.Obama the nod over Romney.Romney and his wealthy friends do'nt need police protection like the rest of us,they hire their own security companies for their protection.And as far as teachers go,they're not worried about their children getting a good education,they send them to private schools.
You can add people who need to see a Dr. to that list. They will let them die.
Glen Cook could have been talking about today's American right when he wrote "In their wickedness they are bllind. In their folly they persist."
My take on this is that "we" misunderstand who "the American people" Romney refers to actually are -- here's a hint -- it ain't us!
When he and the rest of the GOP refer to the "American people," what's being said is "those who vote for us." They are speaking to and for "their American people." This is the single most important reason - above all the other reasons - to NOT VOTE FOR A SINGLE REPUBLICAN unless and until all of the elected Republicans start to represent We, the People - ALL OF US. [And although a cold day in hell is getting closer with climate change and all, it won't happen any time soon.]
The attack on fire, police and teachers is Step 1 - "divide and conquer." Ooooh, the big bad unions - they cost soooo much! That's why YOU lost your job; because THEY - them others who think they are better'n you - demanded all the money and now we're broke. Make the unemployed angry at anyone who does have a job whether union or not, but bust the unions first and the rest follows.
Next step - well, who cares if we don't have enough teachers in public schools. We care; that's why we're going to give you a voucher so you can send your kid to "private" (which means a "corporate" school owned and operated by Koch Bros.)
Next step - Yes, we know that the voucher doesn't cover the cost of tuition at the "corporate school" but what're you gonna do; there is no more public school. You'll just have to ante up, if you want your kid to go to be competitive in the job market [not competitive with MY kid, but, you know, with all you other "little people"] But really, what's the point; you won't ever be able to afford one of those corporate colleges!
And it just follows from there . . . .
God Bless the United States of America, Inc.! Oh, make that LLC cause you know like WE'RE not liable - you know, personal responsibility and all that stuff and such like. It's YOUR fault your parents weren't coporate persons. [Hey, can corporate persons marry? Cause like how would we know if it is one male and one female?]
The unemployed are not angry at the employed. Unions were formed to protect workers from being trampled on as they lay dying on the factory floor suffering and coughing out blood because of the severe working conditions and Industrial disease. We as Americans don't need to revisit that era. But, the GOP welcome it they are supporting the very thing Abraham Lincoln abolished, slavery. Because it means more money in their pocket. They forgot one thing their jobs are also on the line, and The Large corporations won't blink an eye at putting them to work for $1.oo a week mopping up the mess they will be making on the factory floors. They need to watch their backs, these rich Companies have enough money to buy another country, do you really think they're gonna take anybody here along with them. Greed kills and it will eventually kill them.
I didn't see it as a gaffe. Remember. Romney likes firing people. MSM is always giving Romney cover, especially MSNBC sister cable network to Bain/NBC owned Weather Channel.
First Republicans go after gays, religions other than their own, and trade unionists. It's inevitable that your middle class standard of living will go next.
American workers are expendable. The Job Creators can always outsource your job or bring back cheap foreign workers....and the Republicans will as part of their version of the Dream Act. It's the ultimate wet dream of every hostile takeover corporate raider.
ALL Republicans enjoy firing people who perform extremely vital services to the community?
What do we need them for if they can't even see the problem of not being prepared for emergencies? It's like Katrina and 911 all over again.
The news should start dubbing his voice and replace the words American People with the words 1% that is who he is really referring to. They should do that with all the GOP.Hey,if they can't speak the truth we could certainly fill in the blanks for them. They could even put in a fake pair of lips like Steve Martin did on SNL. Now, I don't care what you say, that there is funny.
The Romney plan is home schooling for all children except rich kids who will go to exclusive private schools, police forces will be replaced by "Stand Your Ground" and "Mandatory Weapon Ownership" laws, fire protection, emergency medical services, highway maintenance, the keeping of official records such as deeds, mortgages, licenses, are all eliminated. All services formally known as public services shall be privatized and become fee for service, all publicly owned property, facilities and equipment shall be sold for pennies on the dollar and all units of local, state and federal government shall be transferred to corporations to operate. That is a dream worth fighting for, at least a billion dollars worth of fighting.
So, this is what the American Dream has been replaced with?Nice going Bush....I mean Romney.
I do believe you have it correct sir . I mean living behind their gated communities with their private schools and private police forces they won't have to worry will they?
Besides that their friends who run the prisons will have plenty of business when habeus corpus is repealed
Republicans use bogus private sector argument against President Obama. He wants the US to be a customer to the private sector and have them hire American workers to build highways and bridges that need updating.
That is the same as recognizing that the US is the biggest customer for the defense private sector. Maybe Republicans know of some private citizens buying aircraft carriers, nuclear submarines, or Bombers; but I don't know of any.
The defense purchases are primarily used to destroy things. Bombers are particularly proficient at destroying infra-structure, other countries' of course! Then the Republicans approve billions to rebuild what they destroyed under the guise of nation building. It is particularly hard to rebuild a country' dead citizens. That is known as collateral damage. The Republicans seem happy with our wars. They spent a lot of money on acquiring these defense toys, and they really wanted an opportunity to strut their stuff, so to speak. The American dead; they are also collateral damage of their grandiose vision as gladiator without equal.
Democrats want to give the private sector money to rebuild in our own country. Republicans continue to approve money used to rebuild foreign countries. The Republican's bogus argument; our country cannot afford it! Really, they will not approve giving the private sector money to hire Americans to help America, but Republicans, at the same time, believe we can give the same money to private sector businesses for doing nothing by calling them tax cuts for the job creators!
The difference seems to be that Democrats think the American people are entitled to get something in return, and it should be in writing. We have already tried the Republican idea of giving tons of money to big banks without a written guarantee of what Americans would get in return, and we all know how well that turned out.
The construction jobs are only part of the workforce needed. Engineers, draftsmen planners, cement makers, steelmakers, big equipment makers, surveyors, equipment makers, hotels restaurants, and security. This list goes on and on. They are all private sector companies, but it starts with a big customer, Uncle Sam!
That's what he means by "leadership:" he knows we're wrong, and will show us the error of our ways.
Hey Rachael,
Below is an idea I have in my head that I would like to see on a mural or cartoon strip, and a big deal be made of it close to election time so the visual is really in everyone's brain while in the voting booth. This is a puzzle to everyone and they really need to see the whole picture at once.
The first panel would portray Congress, businessmen and contractors with their hands folded behind their backs, all looking on as President Obama with a few Americans, are filling a huge hole using shovels. Inside this hole should have several negative-number markers depicting the Bush-Spent Clinton-surplus figures, as well as the deficit figures. The carton should involve a few panels that depict the progression from the first panel to the final panel portraying Obama with many Americans working at the top of this unfinished building built over the covered hole, and on the side of the building would be an unfinished spelling of America going up the side of the building.
Around the construction site there would be Romney looking at the building with a Snidely expression on his face and rubbing his hands together all while stand next to 7 letters ready to be mounted- Amercia.
The jobsite should portray Congress arguing about taxes, tax cuts, regulation, etc using little balloons with text . The businessmen should be fat with money hanging from their pockets, and the contractors should look not very busy and their pockets hanging out. There should be barriers protecting the building that have various regulations labeled on them such as Dodd Franks and so on. These barriers are blocking demolition and digging machines labeled Bush Tax Cuts, Wall Street, Unpaid for Wars, etc., with all the machines being sizes depicting their financial damage. Of course 911 should be one of the smaller machines.
I could go on and on of course but I am sure you get the picture. I Love your Show Rachael!!!!!!
Romney is an expert in education. At Cranbrook, where he attended prop school, the average class size was about fifteen per class. No public school can compare to that level of class size. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to know that smaller classes are better for education, for students and teachers. So much for the benefit of larger class sizes.