I was going to make the same point, or raise the same issue. Can the ACLU go to the judge two weeks before the election and say "Hey, we read your ruling and it said you expected all these logistics to be in place, and they're NOT, so can we haz suspension of the law pleez?" The judge would be within his rights to suspend the law until 2013 (or later) pending logistics to actually provide everyone with a card.

Tricky question that depends on how the state's jurisdiction law works. In some states, an appeal divests the trial court of the power to issue further orders while the appeal is pending, in some states an interlocutory appeal like this one (that is, an appeal from a preliminary order rather than a final judgment), does not deprive the trial court to continue with the case on stuff unrelated to the precise issue on appeal.

No idea how it works in Pennsylvania.

The... judge simply ignored these details. Why? Just because.

Just because... he's a Rape-Public-CON.

;-)

Can you imagine if the Democrats disenfranchised and sponsored Poll Taxes in order for Republicans to vote?

The 2012 Mayan Calendar would have to be bumped up a couple of months.

We're missing the point by dwelling on procedural possibilities. How could the judge find the state to be a good faith actor when they enacted the statute for a fraudulent purpose and then admitted it, along with their true intentions? The judge himself is not acting in good faith. Is he elected? A republican? All he has to do is make phony findings and grant adjournments until it's too late, and then shrug and say he tried. Where the hell is DOJ?

DOJ is dealing with this issue in as many as 30 states; that's where they are.

Snide, thoughtless, contemptuous and wrong. You cannot "get it free at multiple places" - unless you attend a Pennsylvania college, or already work for the state and aren't a teacher (!). And yes, it has to be a recent photo ID, and can be rejected if the poll worker doesn't think the photo looks enough like you. The chance of someone at 71 being a current employee or a college student is pretty slim, don't you think? Here's a list of the requirements of the law:

http://www.aclupa.org/downloads/FAQVoterID53112.pdf

And to tell an elderly person who undoubtably has already suffered much of the loss of family, mobility and community that accompanies growing old that "you might want to stop living in isolation" is just @!$%#ing heartless. Thank you, "Rufus," for confirming every prejudice I have about supporters of this law.

@rufus - The present system required an ID that tied you to an address + your signature when you vote that matches your signature from last time you voted and that has been good enough to prevent in person voter fraud since like FOREVER. The system works. It's not broke; doesn't need fixing.

The NEW law requires a photo ID BUT to get the photo ID showing 2 proofs of residence (ID that ties you to an address) is just the beginning. In addition, you now must show a Birth Certificate with a raised seal (not sure what happens if your state of birth is not PA and it doesn't issue raised seal certs) PLUS a Social Security card. Of course, that works for men, but for women who changed their names at marriage, they have to show the marriage cert (not sure about raised seals there) showing the chain of birth name to married name. Now if per chance you were married more than once, than add those certs too.

If you have a Driver's license you just show up and vote with that because it has a picture on it. So, like ummm the DMV issued that license without all of the "back up" certs with raised seals and 2 proofs of address, etc. How's that work? They know who I am because I drive a car? BUT not because I have been voting with the same signature for 40+ years?

Also, someone posed this question - how does someone living at home with parents show 2 IDs tying them to an address? They have no lease, pay no electric, gas, real estate taxes?

All of this to "prevent" imaginary fraud! There should be massive demonstrations all over this state addressed to the Supreme Court of PA. Take note Justices and follow the law.

to get proper ID, if one does not have a proper birth certificate, one must drive to certain cities to the birth/death records building. one can do it by the internet or a request by mail.

the elderly, the poor, the disadvantaged - people who lost practically everything for what ever reason...are screwed.

i find this frustrating.

in order to get a proper ID, one must show birth certificate..

in order to get a proper birth certificate to get the ID, one must have the proper ID.

http://www.portal.state.pa.us/portal/server.pt?open=514&objID=556848&mode=2

granted, there is a backdoor way - but there is a process. if you are 'homeless' or have just moved...or whatever, it can be quite difficult.

some just say eff it.

to day-3905329 I hope you get the opportunity to vote this year,it's every one's right,maybe there is public transportation in your area like buses or taxi service or even transportation services for the elderly who dont drive anymore,but if the "broad outreach campaign" does contact you that's great,people need to fight this voter suppression law,it's not right,and I feel it is unconstitutional,and totally unAmerican....and to rufus 6 rufus there's no need for such rude remarks.....you might want to act like you have some manners..If you have any.

@rufus-6-rufus:

Ask someone to drive you . . . for free? What are you, some kind of Communist?

I mean, isn't it a type of theft to extract a service from another person without recompense?

Exactly. No one mentions that this judge is a Republican, because they don't want to be accused of "bias," as if the lunatic right-wingers didn't already accuse every news outlet besides Fox and AM radio of being liberally biased already.

Also, this judge was elected for his last 10 year period as Judge just last year. He will turn 70 during this term and be ineligible for re-election. So he's set. It wasn't even about re-election, just pay back.

Well yes, what about "everyone else"? How is it that out of "hundreds of thousands" of people excluded from voting you've only produced the one? Why wasn't she clever enough to ask the judge to include at least some of the "hundreds of thousands" in the judges waiver?

I don't think they exist at all.

In fact I have to ask whether Applewhite gets a SS check, and if so, without a SS number? Sadly, I suspect Ms Applewhite is committing fraud of one sort or another.

"Why wasn't she clever enough to ask the judge to include at least some of the "hundreds of thousands" in the judges waiver?"

Because, dimwit, the judge wasn't the one who made the exception - The local clerk did, most likely to dodge the inevitable criticism that would follow another rejection of her ID card.

The (republican) judge himself acknowledged that hundreds of thousands would be excluded, but was trusting that the (republican led) voter outreach efforts would be sufficient.

The only fraud around here is you.

OK fine, why didn't the clerk investigate other cases? Because they don't exist? And I still want to know if Ms Applewhite is getting SS.

There are ten plaintiffs in the case and the Philadelphia Inquirer has done a series on others as well.

Oh, yikes. Ten plus a few others. All this BS, for a few?

What a waste. Instead of all this drama it seems the left could have organized a bus to round up the undocumented and taken care of the whole thing in a few days. But no, the left's love of drama can not be requited.

Ten plus a few others. All this BS, for a few?

It's called "standing." It affects a thing called "jurisdiction." It's basic high-school civics. I understand that GED programs cover civics and will teach the course to pretty much anyone, so you could take a class and maybe learn something.

"Oh, yikes. Ten plus a few others. All this BS, for a few?"

No in-person fraud in Pennsylvania. Yet they passed a law disenfranchizing thousands. It is the law that is BS, and this is the fallout.

Shooter, what about the others who have yet to discover that they don't have the proper ID? The ones who have voted in every election for years who think they're "safe", only to be ultimately turned away should they attempt to vote in November?

And: "What a waste. Instead of all this drama it seems the left could have organized a bus to round up the undocumented and taken care of the whole thing in a few days. But no, the left's love of drama can not be requited." Are you kidding me? You seriously support a law that requires one political group to round up it's citizens in order to help them have the same rights as other citizens? My god, you just make the case for "the left". That's just as bad, if not worse, than a poll tax.

So why is the ruling not null and void if he allowed one person to get theirs without the documentation. Why can't they file some kind of discrimination suit naming the other 700 hundred thousand plus. How can he forgo his ruling for just one person? Where the hell is the DOJ in all of this. They should be all over this and they are not.

I believe there were other plaintiffs involved, so it could still move forward without her....I'm not a lawyer, though, so I could be wrong about that.

In most states, and in federal law, a class action suit cannot be stopped (Legalese: "mooted") by the other side by simply granting the relief demanded for the class to a single member, or to the class representatives, on a one-off basis.

An appeal has already been filed: http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/pa-voter-id-case-political-campaigns-press-17016932

Also note this re: DOJ:

State elections officials have until the middle of next week to supply information to the U.S. Department of Justice, which is looking at Pennsylvania's law and has moved to block voter ID laws in other states. Another lawsuit is pending from the state's second-most populous county, Allegheny County.

and this:

At the state Supreme Court, votes by four justices would be needed to overturn Commonwealth Court Judge Robert Simpson's ruling. The high court is currently split between three Republicans and three Democrats following the recent suspension of Justice Joan Orie Melvin, a Republican who is fighting criminal corruption charges.

So here we go again. It's down to Republican vs Democrat and I guess the State Constitution and the law will have nothing to do with it. Let's hope there is at least one Rep. Justice with integrity.

Let's hope there is at least one Rep. Justice with integrity

I'm always willing to be pleasantly surprised shocked astonished...

;-)

That's what I was thinking...it's nice for her, but not beating up little old ladies doesn't necessarily make good guys out of those implimenting this law.

I live in PA and I'm also waiting for the outcry from Republicans that she was actually allowed to get her ID without the required documentation. Now the law will be "too flexible".

Indeed, it doesn't sound like the grant was even legal under the law they passed.

not beating up little old ladies

?

Sounds more like a bad old joke: when did they stop beating up little old ladies?

;-)

SS doesn't require a picture ID. Besides, all of this fiasco shows they can grant whatever they want, and the point is to make sure the President doesn't have a win in PA. Wake up!

Perhaps you missed the part where she says her purse was stolen, and with it all of her photo IDs. She has tried, to no avail, to get a new birth certificate. Not surprising that a right wing nut would only hear what he wants to hear. Sort of like your new bromance, RomRyan.

It's just like a Teatard to assume that people in question are receiving some type of aid, yet contradict their own argument at the same time. I there aid requires some type of identification to receive the benefits they are receiving it would stand to reason that they would not be part of the group being disenfranchised. Teatards should think before they speak. Remember, assumptions are the genesis of all screw ups and you people screw up all the time.

My understanding is that she did indeed have ID until her purse was stolen and when she tried to replace it she didn't have proper documentation because her marriage certificate showed a different name and the state where she was born had lost the birth records or didn't have them going back 93 years. To imply that this woman is somehow committing SS fraud is ridiculous.

Having lived in inner city Philadelphia several years ago, I can say that there are certainly thousands of people who operate daily without photo ID. This is especially true of those who don't drive and use public transportation. This law definitely impacts the elderly, disabled, and minorities to a greater degree than other groups. I hope the Supreme Court will be aware of the inadequacy of the state "outreach" to address the problems with this law in a timely manner.

The plaintiff is the case testified that they could find no instance of voter fraud, and that they did not suspect there would ever be voter fraud; so of course, they need a new photo ID law to keep the status quo. You must have a gov't issued ID, and you must pay to get one if you need to replace your birth certifate.

http://www.padems.com/content/voteridinfo

You can do that? Well then :)

Shooter who?

It's seductively easy to do - just click on the little "exclamation point" at the bottom right of any given comment and click on your choice(s) from a menu of ways of dealing with trolling, spamming and other inappropriate commentary:

"Report This Item As:
No Value
Inflammatory
Advertising
Ignore This Author"

Choosing the last one on the list will cause all of that author's comments to be collapsed in your view (you can always expand them again if you're really that masochistic). You may need to refresh the page if you want to see the effect immediately. One significant benefit, particularly in the case of certain trolls who insist on posting obnoxiously long cut-n-paste jobs (e.g. Hey, It's Pat), is that you recapture and usefully repurpose significant amounts of "screen real-estate". Enjoy!

;-)

Oh, thank you for reminding me!

Ah, so much better now.

How do you have access to the internet, but no identification in your married or maiden names? How have you gotten through life thus far? Have you taken and picked up children from school, or ever worked or filed a tax return? You must have *something* linking your name and address. Even the Amish do.

If you know NOW that you will need to have state issued identification, why aren't you trying to get it?

My mom is 86, was born in Detroit and has a social security card, and gets a statement from her bank, monthly showing Social Security deposits; proof of her SS identification as well as a State issued ID. My inlaws were born in Finland, became Naturalized citizens, get Social Security and have state issued identification.

If you are willing to vote, and so many people aren't, why aren't *you* doing what needs to be done so that you can vote?

Speaking of the Amish, they oppose to having their image photographed due to religious reasons. They have an unduly hardship with this new process. They have to fill out a 7 page document with dissertations on "how they came to believe in their religion" and verification from various other sources such as their bishops as to their identity. This is democracy? I can vote because when I was 16 I applied for my driver's license with a state issued copy of my birth certificate, no raised seal, and no proof of residence. Just a check, please for the fee. PennDot accepted my change of married name with no documentation. It's great that your parents are competent individuals. Where is your compassion for those that may not be. They still have equal rights. Maybe not in PA now. The point is not even ONE eligible voter should be denied the process because of this law. It is easier to apply for Social Security than it is to apply for a voter ID in PA.

Tax Preparer, let me give you one example of how that can happen--and this isn't to assume that this is what happened to METhree, but just to give you an idea that this problem can have legitimate roots.

I married my Greencard Holder Husband in another country, so when I came here to the US, my identity was already as a MARRIED WOMAN. Every single application I made for my own green card, and then eventually my US Citizenship had me filling it out in my married name. There were a few boxes asking me my maiden name and of course I filled that out--BUT GUESS WHAT! All of the ID issued to me--all of the kinds of ID that government agencies--heck, even private companies, accept, had nothing whatsoever to indicate my maiden name. I have my OLD, barely legible birth certificate (I'm 34) and it was issued from a 3rd world country. If I had to get a newer copy it would take me months of International Mailing, wiring money, and affidavits authorizing someone else to do this for me in a place 24 hours away from me by plane. My marriage certificate was also issued by said other country. I have no "Americanized Version" of this marriage certificate. It's all well and good if the poll officer considers this document from another country as valid, but I really doubt it. Whatever ID I had in my maiden name that might be considered valid here--my driver's license, my passport--EXPIRED since I left my native country 9 years ago. So you see my predicament here?

You need to understand the experience of people outside of what you're accustomed to. Just so you know, my mother will be flying over here in December (well after the elections) and she's 60 (she will be legal, too, in case you had any preconceived notions that I'm smuggling illegal aliens into the country). I will petition for her Greencard. I will eventually have her apply for her Citizenship. She was married to my father, but is now a widow. SHE won't have maiden-name ID here in the US either.

My younger brother who has aspergers? I don't know how we'll petition for him yet. He's the only family I have left over there and he'll have no one but my mother and I, but we can't bring him over here, because he's over-aged so he'll have to get left behind. We'll pray he manages on his own even with our long-distance support. We'll hope he doesn't kill himself (he's depressed). We'll fight to get him here LEGALLY so he can possibly get proper medical treatment. If by some miracle, I can get him a greencard and he can become a US Citizen, I don't know if he'll get any valid IDs to vote. I don't know, but back then, being a US Citizen would've been enough. It was enough. Now, I don't know.

Did any of this sink in?

If you worked, and paid into SS, then your employer at some point had to have looked at some sort of identification. You also have your name and address linked to your paycheck and now your SS statements and either bank deposits or check mailed to you link your name and address.

Oh, when my neighbor applied for SS, she had to show ID at the office.

Teatards think everything is welfare that isn't given to the rich or corporations!

Next thing will be if you have a job it's welfare because some company or corporation gave it to, thus becoming your subsidy.

I live in PA. We can register to vote just like you did BUT with the passing of this law even though I am a card carrying registered voter, I cannot vote unless I have a PICTURE of me on a Government issued ID that ALSO has an expiration date on it.

So there are lots of folks in this state who have picture IDs that have no idea that unless there is a EXPIRATION date that is unexpired, they will not be able to vote.

To date, I have received NOTHING from the Commonwealth notifying me of the new law and its requirements. But since even GovJustCloseYourEyes as well as the Secretry of State cannot tell anyone what the new law requires, how can they tell We, the People . . .oh, I mean You People!

Your wife is registered to vote, but if the voter ID law continues to be upheld and goes into effect, she may find that she is not allowed to vote. If she does not have proper ID on election day, she may be turned away.

If she works for a living, she may only have gotten to the polls after work hours. Maybe she stood in line for a while to get in. By the time she finds that she needs a particular ID, it may be fifteen minutes to closing. Can she get home on time to find proper documentation and get back before they close?

If she has no drivers license, but perhaps has a state-issued picture ID at home, for check-cashing purposes, then she's walking home, right?

If circumstances for your wife are what many working poor experience, then your wife is effectively disenfranchised. She is not a felon. She is not a foreigner. She is not mentally deficient. But she has the same ability to vote that those people have: none.

Erskine Bowles? As in co-author, with Alan "310 Million Tits" Simpson, of the Simpson-Bowles "plan" that couldn't even pass approval of the... wait for it... Simpson-Bowles (aka "Cat Food") Commission, much less the Congress? You mean that Erskine Bowles?

Hmm. Oh well. I guess he's entitled to his stupid opinion. And I'm entitled to laugh at it: Bwaahahahahahaha!

;-)

Exactly. If a woman's 'married name' is not resolved with her identity prior to the election, she is disenfranchised. It's a feature, not a bug.

Worst. They won't get money from the Koch brothers, Carl Rove, and all the rest of their money monkeys.

You are a constitutional scholar! Well, said. The whole point behind the continental congress. Raises the point that our laws come forth from the Congress of the United States when the Constitution says "United States in Congress Assembled."