Gridlock is good.

Geithner was BANG-ON yesterday. i agreed with virtually everything he said on "meet the press" and "fox news sunday".

boehner, representing the repub party, was his same old boring un-motivated, lip-twitching self, lacking skills of DOING HIS JOB, unable to see the "lay of the land' as peggy noonan suggested he can. she also said he was willing to make a deal. i don't see it. i have to wonder what peggy is looking at. maybe this is just part of the 'dance", but all i see is more of "nothing new" so far. another fiscal cliff responsible by the repubs? that's how the american people see it.

(peggy noonan, pull your head out of ronald reagan's ass.)

repubs are just waiting for Obama to come to their side, to their meaning of the word "compromise", or as boehner (who can't even say the word "compromise") says, "common ground".

Gridlock is good.

Yeah, if you hate America.

I mean, what kind of ass-backwards, pissy, head-in-the-sand bullsh!t statement is that?

I think it was sarcasm.

I think it was sarcasm.

No. It is the Right-wing version of a temper tantrum - Hold your breath until you get your way.

Time for a time out.

i don't think it was sarcasm. i have heard repubs in washington say the same thing. to them, gridlock is better than anything President Obama wants, surely you can see that after the past 4 years.

The thing is, there isn't actually gridlock this time. The sequester occurs in January if a deal isn't reached. Everyone's taxes go up. Something will happen. This is just a game of chicken, at this point, and the GOP is going to lose.

she also said he was willing to make a deal. i don't see it. i have to wonder what peggy is looking at

She's looking at the same fantasy landscape Boehner is: wait long enough, and the desperate Administration will finally bow down and offer to eliminate Medicare and Social Security (but keep the payroll taxes.) At which point Congressional Republicans will publicly deplore the heartless Democratic proposal, but out of sheer desperation for the future of our country they'll force themselves to go along, just enough to barely let the legislation pass despite the protest votes from Republicans in vulnerable districts.

...hold your breath until you get your way...

With any luck, the right wing will "hold their breath" until the country turns "blue".

The trouble with ignorance is that it picks up confidence as it goes along.
- Arnold H. Glasow

;-)

Gridlock is good, because it keeps the 'party of free stuff' in check.

Not sure gridlock's the answer, but I'm surprised and glad you want to keep the Republicans in check.

What's blanks got against the GOP?

There weren't any spending cuts in the Obama offer, just spending increases. Which illustrates the validity of the belief any tax increases will just bring more spending, not less debt.

Shooter, Your side created the debt. When GWB came in, there was a SURPLUS!!!! (caps on and exclamation points so it can through your thick skull) Your guy Cheney kept telling us that your guy Reagan proved that deficits don't matter. So your guys ran the government (into the ground) for 8 years on a credit card, which your guys refuse to pay.

Sick!

Shooter, the supply side, trickle down, tax cuts for the rich economic philosophy you espouse has been tried for decades and it has failed, miserably, for the vast majority of Americans. We've tried it your way, and the results are painfully obvious.

Are you FOR turning America into a 3rd world country??

Shooter, I didn't say there were spending cuts "in the deal". I said that Obama has said he will explore spending cuts (as he did last year, before Ryan and Boehner decided they couldn't allow him to look reasonable or responsible in an election year).

My larger point was that Boehner, McConnell and the entire Republican establishment and their followers are a bunch of hypocrites for demanding ANY specificity from Obama when they nor their loser of a candidate offered none themselves.

Obama won, and the American People strongly support his policies. Surveys and polls support this. You lost.

Sorry Dave, but conservatives are going to fight you tooth and nail. Prepare for the status quo to be gridlock.

Citizen, you have no idea what it takes to run a business, earn a profit, or make a payroll. In fact, you can't grasp the obvious truth that in order to pay someone, the employer must have more money than the employee... as in trickle down. Republicans are saving the country by keeping folks like you at bay.

Sam, come back when you learn the difference between debt and deficit.

Shooter - in order for the employer to have any increased commerce and sales and money, the populace needs to keep a bit of their money to spend on the essentials they need... to be back on their feet after the affects of the Great Recession, to not be so squeezed by GOP plan that redistributes $5 Trillion to the top 4%, and necessitate raising taxes on the other 96% through cutting deductions and tax benefits for the vast majority of Americans... So with regular folks even MORE squeezed, the the top 4% will "refrain" from spending to build more factories, jobs, etc because they will observe that demand is too low in US economy... The top 4% spending on goods and services in the US can only go so far to support the economy, then plateaus (deep, deep pockets, but small, small group)... What smart business leader expands when demand from the other 96% is so anemic...? So that same 4% (who has recovered from Great Recession, as shown by increasing DOW in 2011 - 2012, and increased spending on high end goods, Bergdorf & Goodman, luxury homes, cars, islands, castles, etc.) is decidedly NOT investing to spur so-called "trickle down" ... Still your answer is to squeeze the rest of the 96% even MORE by redistributing another $5 Trillion to the top 4% over next 10 years? Oh good - let's let those who are already squeezed shoulder the burden of chipping down the debt through cutting their deductions, have those who would otherwise actually buy goods and services from small businesses struggle more...while funneling Trillions to the group that is not spending or investing in America... The top 4% with the off-shore accounts and the zero-sum mentality, "think I'll be sitting this one out" crowd... Let's give them a pass, let them funnel some more millions to tax havens in the Caribbean or in Europe... That's your plan to kick start a flagging economy? Good thinkin... The re-adjust to increased 2.7 rate of GDP growth in Q3 was accomplished in spite of your kind of philosophies, you're the headwind to increasing the economy...

Government is not a "business; not unless that business can print its' own money. And no, selling stock or bonds isn't the same as printing money.

There's no reason for everyone in this country to suffer just because Republicans have shown that they don't understand economics. We've had thirty years of trickle-down economics and that "theory" is just what George H.W. Bush called it: voo doo economics. It originally relied on faith to do what was was promised, has been shown not to work, and still relies on faith, in the face of a proven track record that it doesn't work, for anyone to continue to back it. And here I thought Republicans didn't believe in "theories"!

Nor can you, honestly, argue that high marginal tax rates will destroy the economy. We had 90% marginal rates and the economy boomed. There are many, many books in existance that will explain it to you, try reading them. You have access to a computer (no, I won't say it!), you can find them yourself.

Have a nice search!

Jay, where do you think consumers get their money? Jobs provided by business. Please see the oil and gas boom in North Dakota.

Doug, when you consider 90% rates, don't forget to consider the deductions, loopholes, and shelters, that went with them. And... the fact that we firebombed all our competitors manufacturing capability.

The Times broke the link

That was a great column. Force them to take ownership of the cuts instead of saying it's Obama's cuts

The Republicans are working a con job. They want Obama to go along with their ambiguous revenue increases so that Obama agrees to extend all the tax rates without having any specifics with a Republican promise to negotiate later. After the cuts are extended and the time comes for specifics about the sources of revenue the Republicans are lay off all the new revenue on the middle class and poor. If Obama refuses to go along they will hold the debt ceiling hostage and blame him for the impasse because the Republicans have no intention of acting in good faith. It is a con job that Republicans are hoping Obama falls for.

The republicans want the cuts so they get to enumerate them.

Hey inspector w/a bazillion numbers - What don't you get? Been watching too much FOXNEWS lately?

In the sane world, if you say you want to cut something, you come with a list of just what it is you want to cut, and why! Boehner needs to show up with his cuts in hand, and explain to the American people just why he wants the cuts he wants! Don't put the cart before the horse, you'll only give the horse a bruised nose!

No, inspector w/a bazillion, even Willis knows what he's talking about when it is noticed your post makes no sense! -Kevo

Kevofrombenensass The post was an effort to get your boyfriend to throw in a few more facts when he does his usual attack ads. Sorry it made you cry.

Exactly. Clearly it's Obama's fault for not telling the GOP what the GOP wants to cut. After all, it's been Congressional tradition (over the past 4 years) to refuse to cooperate with any plan that doesn't make the Democrats and Obama look bad. Accordingly, tradition demands that the Left do the Right's work for them, and suggest cuts so that the Right can use it against them in their campaign ads a year from now.

It's like a handicap in golf. The Republicans can't compete so there has to be some kind of fudge-factor to make it even, right?

Hey dude, your disdain for our duly elected POTUS is showing if it is Pres. Obama you claim is my "boyfriend" and by showing your prejudice, it is simply one more reason you and any of your cohorts can't be reasoned with before you lose your hate for this two term president.

Until you, inspector with a bazillion numbers, come around to a more sensible thought of accepting all no matter their back grounds, you will not have the character to sit at the grand table of American democracy!

Until then, your unreasonableness will take the day no matter the evidence or verifiable observations presented! If you truly believe some sort of "attack ads" exist in our post election moment, you are delusional too boot! -Kevo

Get a grip Kevo, and read the post again. I was talking about Benen not Obama. The point is that democrats will never make the drastic cuts that are needed to balance the budget, no matter who they tax into oblivion. You don't seem to mind at all that our kids and their kids will be paying for the B.S. that the dem's and repubs are pulling on a daily basis. Until it is more profitable to work than it is to stay home on welfare, this crap will continue. and don't give me that crap about the poor not being able to pull themselves up and get themselves out of poverty. I have done it myself.

The only "entitlement" cuts I want to see President Obama offering are 1) defense cuts, 2) corporate welfare, 3) a change in capital gains and investment to align more closely with wage income, 4) a decrease in subsidies for businesses that do not need subsidies. I do not want to see Obama offering cuts to social programs, aside from cuts based on better negotiating with providers -- if the GOP wants these (cuts to Medicare, SS, etc,), they need to put those on the table specifically, on their own. Own what they want. Act like grownups.

On the Sunday programs, one person suggested that if the GOP wanted Obama to offer cuts to social programs (which we all know is what the GOP wants), the GOP would have to explicitly promise never ever to use such offers against the Dems. The GOPs on the program did not like that. Of course.

I fully support this negotiating technique. I approve of making the GOP say what they actually want -- and if there is heat to be taken, they take it. I'm tired of scared children trying to pretend to govern.

And, inspector, I've pulled myself out of bad situations, too. But I am relatively smart, with a college degree and a nice variety of skills-- and a belief that I could. You fail to understand who a lot of the poor are if you think they can do the same. It's not so easy with a low IQ, mental health issues, a poor education and a sense of hopelessness. And, often, no sense of how to do that at all. They need help to move out of that cycle.

The point is that democrats will never make the drastic cuts that are needed to balance the budget, no matter who they tax into oblivion.

Well, twelve years ago we not only had a balanced budget, we were on track to pay off the debt in less than a decade. So what "drastic cuts" do we need to get back to that condition?

• Social Security? No change.
• Medicare? Drop Part D.
• Medicaid? No change.
• Defense? Well, now, there's some money there.

Mostly, though, it looks like taxes. Which is what that graph-that-must-not-be-named keeps showing.

Excellent post, Donni Gillies. I'd vote for it 10x if I could!

We have been cutting spending for 2+ years and tanking the economy , so there's the cuts your looking for , now obama and the dems are done with it and we are here to kick your whiny gop ar$$'s , get use to it ...If we do not get the economy moving , we are all back to zero...One of the main pillars to get the debt under control is the economy running properly

Never gonna happen. The GOP will cut a deal in January, when they are able to claim the whole thing is a tax cut on 98% of Americans, and the weasels will point to it proudly and call it a victory at that point. This whole thing going on right now is nothing more than posturing on Boehner's part. He will, in the end, be forced to pass a retroactive tax cut, and he knows it.

Are you a victim Rich? You know, a victim of the FOXNEWS propaganda machine?

The fiscal cliff leads to the Clinton Tax rates! Remember the Clinton Tax rates? The rates that led to untold prosperity until the Bush Tax cuts came along with two unpaid Bush Wars of choice and a non-paid-for-pharm-Medicare give away, and presto we're here.

Now you're complaining about tax rates we've already put into effect, prospered with, and built up a surplus to keep our economy strong before the madness of Bush the Younger took its toll upon our beloved nation?

Go home and cry me a river! -Kevo

Plan on paying $3,000-$5,000 more in taxes (average) next year and having your benefits cut by 10-20%,

Works for me. By rights I and those in similar situation should have been paying more for the last eleven years, and I'm not going to be missing any particular benefits.

I do worry about the damage that doing this now will do to the economy and those "benefits" are what are keeping some people -- especially children -- fed and out of homeless shelters (another "benefit" that will get hit.)

Frankly, though, I suspect that going full McConnell will be good for the country well before the long term. We'll survive, but a lot of illusions won't.

Actually Freddie, 100% of Americans will be getting a tax cut if the make a deal in January after the Bush cuts expire, it's just that 2% of Americans will only have their taxes cut on the first $250K in taxable income, with no cut on their income over that amount and they won't be breaking their precious pledge to Norquist, as they would be cutting taxes not raising them.

@Brewer, you're right, of course. I misspoke.

The other taxes are also outlined in the plan which is now online and readable by all American Citizens. What is the Republican plan for revenue that Boehner "put on the table." Where are the numbers? How much and from what source? I'm not talking about generalities like "removing loopholes", but hard numbers from specific sources. That document doesn't exist so, for all intents and purposes, Republicans have put no tax increases on the table. All Republicans have done is laughed at the President's proposal. That's not a negotiation.

Where is Boehner's plan? Where can I read about it? How much revenue (because he says he took a risk by putting revenue on the table) and from whom? I can't quote numbers our sources because I haven't seen it. What am I missing here?

Agree with DougH -- I would also like to see what Boehner's plan is. Where can I find it? Yes, I am certain that whatever he might propose would make me laugh/snort in exasperation and want to say something about Obama winning the election not Ryan (Romney being a nullity at this point), but I would still like to see what he actually wants and what is actually on the table. Tell me where to look.

I fanned you a 100x!

I remember ol' Mittens saying that he didn't need a budget plan, because Boehner was going to tell us all what his position was after the election !