Associated Press
I often wonder if congressional Republicans believe their own talking points, or if they no longer care about credibility (via Kevin Drum).
"The president made a strategic miscalculation and overreached," said one GOP aide granted anonymity to discuss party strategy. "He could have worked to reach a fair agreement, but instead he picked a fight, poisoned the well, and now we are likely to have a rather unproductive next four years. The decision he made only hurts himself."
It's unclear whether the GOP aide was able to say this with a straight face or not.
Let's quickly recap the fiscal process in case anyone is confused. President Obama presented a platform to the nation in 2012, and was rewarded with 332 electoral votes, during the same election cycle in which Democrats added seats in both the House and Senate. After the election, the president proposed -- get this -- implementing his agenda, which enjoys broad public support.
As talks progressed, Obama then started accepting concessions -- twice lowering his revenue target, accepting entitlement policies his own base hates, and even moving away from his $250,000 income threshold -- only to find his Republican negotiating partner walk away from the table.
This, for Republicans, is evidence of presidential "overreach." By embracing his own platform, and then accepting concessions, Obama "picked a fight" and "poisoned the well."
I'm especially amused by this notion that Washington politics will now be "unproductive" for the next four years.
The quote suggests Republicans would have been cooperative and interested in serious governing, but that mean ol' president hurt their feelings -- by, you know, pursing policies he supports -- so now they'll be obstinate and obstructionist.
If only Obama had been more gracious after winning re-election, agreeing to give up his own agenda and start adopting more Republican ideas, his second term would have been far more productive.
It's like peering into an alternate universe, where facts have no meaning.
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I think the name of that anonymous source was Fiscal Cliff Clavin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6GTZrcoWEM
Good one, John! Kudos and props.
When I hear that sort of rhetoric - referenced in the article and covered by anonymity - and also read the blithering fantasy and mean, twisted, small-minded ignorance that was secretly recorded on that 'Ship of Fools' Republican strategy cruise, it reinforces that money cannot buy either intelligence or happiness.
What bothers me the most, however, is that the billionaires and millionaires who could (maybe) legitimately figure that money = power and their wants can be satisfied by buying a few Senators and Congresscritters, have somehow thoroughly convinced an enormous percentage of ordinary and very decidedly NOT rich people to go along with all this crapola!
Why is it we hear unemployed millenials and $35k/year construction workers telling us that raising tax rates for millionaires will increase unemployment because they are the "job creators?" That is patently bullpucky!
What is never said, but is the fact, the Republicans in Congress are playing the Koch Brothers negotiating strategy. Boehner cares about the country. The Kochs do not! They have spent over $30 million on lobbying alone and have spent hundreds of billions on bribery (campaign contributions) and intimidation (we will run a T.E.A. party candidate in the primary against you) to secure control of the Republican Conference in the House. The Kochs might give in and agree to a deal before January 1, but it all depends on whether they think it will help them make more money for Koch Industries and whether it will help advance their agenda in the 2014 elections. It's not about Boehner, it's not about the Republicans in the House, it's about the Kochs and their power and when they decide that it is right for them to make a deal.
Carolina Lady
The reason people believe is due the GNOP Talking Points and message discipline. Repeated exposure to the same stimulus causes neural changes in the brain. The GNOP has mastered that propaganda technique.
The Echo Chamber is simply a thousand different voices repeating the same mantra over and over. Religions use this methodology. Our schools use this methodology. The advertisers use this method. A simple message repeated endlessly.
The Truth of the Message has little to do with the effectiveness of the message. The GOP only hears the message and has been trained to disregard all other sources. The rest of the world looks at the message and compares it to multiple sources and rejects it.
PatP: then we must do something about education and training our children to think critically, mustn't we?
This would be a lot easier story to ReTweet if it had a more descriptive decontextualized headline.
At the risk of repeating myself from an earlier blog entry, I will:
So, as it appears this morning, Boehner and all have no possibility of passing anything in the House because the House can't pass anything. Period. So, where's the "bargaining" supposed to take place? It seems that the hostage has already been withheld, forgotten, disrespected, and now is to be killed, and then--and only then--can any meaningful negociations take place? Remember, it's the American citizenry that is the hostage to all this. And, the House Republicans and TeaPottiers have only themselves to blame. I'm not the President, but I think it's time for a bit of forceful public negotiation: 1) a 20 minute prime timer in which the Chief Executive of this nation goes before the citizens and brings up recent history; 2) then in his speech, the recently-reelected popular President summarizes in great detail the points of his plans to save the economy, the middle class, to protect seniors and the poor, and to do away with corporate welfare; 3) nearing the end of this heartfelt, serious presentation, the screen goes to a slow roll of the names of those House members who have refused to listen to any logic, to any pleas for bi-partisanship, to any demands for 'country first', and the President reads aloud their names--slow roll call of the 'soon-to-be-dead'. Opposition has, for too long, gone un-noticed, especially by the voters who mindlessly put this opposition into office. Tell'em what you'll do, tell'em why you're doing it, tell'em who's in the way. Make the case for your plan, Mr. President. The nation will listen, and then ask ever so forcefully, for the voters in all districts to contact their House members--maybe several times in person!-- and pass your plan on the very next day's vote. And, finally (OK--the 20 minutes just became 30), make evident the COST of not passing your plan. Then, after the vote, we'll know who is leading, we'll know who's obstructing, and we'll know the damaging consequences. ALL of us will know. We can't permit the obstructionists to continue to lie like the snakes they are. And--I do mean 'lie' in every sense of the word.
Sometimes, lies just can't be permitted to 'lie' there.
OK, he does what you say. Let's even imagine that the People of the United States come to a broad agreement that their recently-elected Representatives are scum and should not hold office.
Then what? This is going to change the situation ... how?
The Republicans have said it themselves "Compromise is you giving me what I want"
I just wonder at what point do the people of the united states get tired enough of the tyranny of the minority to fix the problem or if that is even possible at this point.
That's the problem. When you have Congressmen elected by Tea Partiers, who sent them there to obstruct, this is what we get. There's no try in them. They've crossed their arms and decided to go on a sit-down strike. And voting them out is not really an option, because they're doing what they were elected to do.
The target needs to be their electorate. Someone needs to educate those folks that no government can run that way.
Sorry to repeat myself, but let's say that someone does succeed in that remarkable educational feat.
What then?
My point, D.C., is that "those folks" are the people who voted for the Tea Party Congressmen, not the representatives themselves. And of course, that can't take effect until the next election, at the very soonest.
No, my druthers would be to have President Obama and the other Democrats in Congress hold their ground and not give in to these extortionists. There will be a debacle (or should I say Debacle) that results when no agreement can be reached, but caving in for the sake of getting a deal, when the other side is intransigent, is just playing into their hand. At least, on paper it sounds good to me. And then there are the real people who'll suffer. . . .
:-(
Sorry, I'm going to get off my soapbox in a minute.
I can't dismiss the thought of George Orwell's 1984, where he talks about the government installing black boxes on every corner to tell the proletariat "everything they need to know." Well, we have those black boxes, and they're called FOX News, Rush Limbaugh, Matt Drudge, etc.
And therein lies the problem. Try getting through to those voters with some semblance of reason. They're effectively and conveniently innoculated against the truth.
At least if the President did have those press conferences, the people would know. Do nothing and that's what you get in return. Very little can be done before 2014, but much can be. It may be too late but that doesn't mean we should try thing now. We are feeling what "do nothing" did in 2010.
The Tea Party delegation has absolutely no idea how to craft legislation. Their marching orders are to obstruct until they are told to vote 'yes' on particular bills.
Each of them was hand picked for primaries by the same folks that want ALEC to write the laws in favor of whichever billionaire is paying for them. Just like Grover Norquist wanted Mitt Romney as president because all Grover needed was a signature to make law, all some billionaires like the Kochs, or Adelson or the Waltons want is a body of congress-people to vote on bills constructed in their interest by their own lawyers. These are presented to the Tea Party contingent via ALEC.
The Dumbing Down of America Project that has stripped funding from public education for the last 30+ years has resulted in an electorate that doesn't critically think, and is more easily manipulated by perceived attacks on social/tribal concerns. Getting a malleable congress has been a long-term project that begins with building contingents of people who are not educated well enough to understand their own long term best interest.
So, here we are. The best we, as progressives, can do right now is to keep contacting congresspeople and their staffs; any and all public servants to make known that there are those of us who see what is going on. Keep on commenting on blogs or whatever else will make the case for sanity in any kind of public forum. It's important to keep the discussion in the forefront: We care about the immediate situation, and the long term and we are not going away.
Sorry for the rant. :)
To JL in Montana
“We are all capable of believing things which we know to be untrue, and then, when we are finally proved wrong, impudently twisting the facts so as to show that we were right.”
George Orwell
That's lifted from "The Answering of Kautski," an essay by Richard Mitchell in The Leaning Tower of Babel. And it's in a section called "The Political Worth of Ignorance." Really. He was writing 30 years ago about the exact situation we're facing today, where people who believe they've been educated are scarcely capable of sniffing out a scam. It goes on:
And you wonder why the Koch Brothers and various corporate interests bother with policies surrounding our public education system? What is ALEC doing, messing around with our schools?
I never cease to be amazed that Blue states comprise the most affluent and productive sections of this country, while incredibly destructive forces are manipulating so many voters in Red states, and they keep getting away with it.
They live off fear. Fear lets people shut their eyes to the slaughter of their children. That and a believe in their own godhead. Or: clinging to their guns and god.
Congrats - you've fed the god money his virgin blood sacrifice for the day.
Call me crazy, but I'd love to see President Obama come out with a new stance. Total arrogance towards the Republicans whenever and wherever the 'will of the people' is concerned. No more compromising whatsoever. None.
Obama- Just stick to the idea that you represent the majority of Americans and that America doesn't want the same old "keep the rich happy first" mentality anymore.
Yeah, I know that even us Democrats need rich folks, too. But we can at least try to attract the ones who have some sanity... maybe.. ?
But yeah... please try arrogant... compromise is not working
Nice guys come in last
You're crazy! The President must pander to the GOTP with the livelihoods of the Middle Class and the Poor in order to appear civil while negotiating with the ideological terrorist party (GOTP), right?
I'm so happy somebody else said it first, of course, one must walk a fine line in order to appear gracious and inclusive while the "other side" does whatever they damned well please, as ever! We must change our minds if we're going to compromise! Perfect sense!!
I think you are spot on. I wonder though, how deep can our President play their games without becoming like them?
Impeachment is always on the Republican table and Fox is always in the hen house of public opinion.
I believe you meant to reference the 2012 elections not the 2008.
Unproductive next 4 years? That's laughable after the last 12 unproductive years. When was the last time congress did anything that was actually good for the country, you know, without putting their personal agenda first?
1980s, when they tried to stop Iran-Contra? 70s with the watergate impeachment?
I think I have to go back to the post ww2/eisenhower era to find that sort of government action.
John you can not be serious!!!!! Have we all forgotten about the CALM Act??? You know, the bill congress passed in 2010 to make sure that TV commercials are at the same volume as the show we were watching. How can you suggest that they haven't done anything meaningful? Take it back!
And that law is still not been enacted.
True, now I can watch TV without going deaf. Yay, congress! Ugh.
Check out the old tv show "Emergency". These pre-Reagan unionized public servants discuss how to improve their efficiency while shining the equipment on the truck. Creating dramatic tension through trying to do good....... what a foreign concept in America.
Bulling starts at the top by roll models of the elected. A strong majority voted for President Obama knowing his agenda.. But like the debt ceiling crisis the old GOP vocal minority of the 2% will tank the economy for there supporters gains...
It was his fault. You only have to look at his inflexible insistence on ludicrous positions. For instance, letting the colored folks participate in the discussions.
another fox news uninformed
The lab called. Your sarcasmometer is waaaaay overdue for recalibration.
ROFLMAO....
GOOD MORNING -- BREAKFAST CLUB!
If the President were to insist that McConnel and Boehner come to the WH every morning from 7 - 7:30 a.m. until there is a grand bargain and the issues of taxes, a budget framework going forward and the debt ceiling are resolved? If they fail to comply have the Democrats bring up a bill to unseat them for failing to carry out their Congressional duties.
Congress critters do not work at the pleasure of the POTUS or other Congress critters.
Actually you are wrong, both the House and the Senate determine which of their members they will seat.
Until the tea party, and their cohorts, become totally marginalized, I can't see how things are going to change much.
The only hope for the country, is that the non-tea party republicans get so fed up with the tea party that they do something we haven't seen in a long time in Washington.
They align themselves more with the Democrats than with the tea party.
Just wonder if and when John Boehner will give up on the teaparty people and reach a deal with some more reasonable republicans and democrats. If he doesn't, things will get worse soon.
Here goes, and this statement will probably ruffle some feathers:
"The Man must bow to his Masters."
They are arrogant enough to believe that he will do so ultimately, so they can claim power over him.
There is no compromise, because in their minds, it's a one-way conversation.
These guys have not hidden the fact that they will not cooperate with the President. Think about it. It's not because he's a Democrat, (but that's a good excuse) and I'm more and more convinced (by what I observe) that they refuse to accept him as an equal because he is who (what) he is.
They believe he cheated his way to the Presidency, they call him every name in the book, (unprecedented in history) and they publicly show a disdain I have never seen before in American politics. it's PURE hatred. The Republicans who are beyond this mentality are crouched in a corner, unwilling to act, for fear they will get primaried, which makes this even more pathetic. I've said before, they are more concerned with keeping their seats than doing the right thing.
It's bloody maddening that we have elected officials acting like this.
Even more maddening that folks actually insist on (continually) voting them in.
They've made a mockery of what we know to be Democracy, and the rest of the world is watching us embarass ourselves in the process.
The article reads
It should probably be 2012 instead.
Boehner told the President the house would take up anything the Seante passed. WOW. June: the Senate passed a bill to extend the middle class tax cuts. House has not taken it up. Sept.: Senate passed the Farm bill extention. The house hasn't taken it up. The Senate has passed 23 bills the haouse has not even looked at. Why should anybody believe Boehner?
What is COMPROMISE to the GOP?
Gut obamacare , social security and medicare by 50% now , that is " MEETING THEM 1/2 WAY " in their minds , anything other than that is "overreached " by obama and the dems
Then next year , they want the exact same thing
The time for dems to hold their ground on this type of ideological governing was 20 years ago , tell your dem reps we are done feeding the bloated defense budget , and drowning our constitutional gov in the bath tub , while refusing to invest in other parts of the american economy
I seriously doubt that most of the uneducated red staters have ever read "1984". Maybe if someone made a movie of it they'd go see it, but read a freaking book?!? Not likely! Come on Spielburg, we need you help getting this message across about how brainwashed these people are. And after it's over a little look at the future (now). A picture is worth.....
Steve, don't you mean the President won in 2012 with 332 votes?
Republicans ONLY have power in the house of representatives because of gerrymandering, which is something that seems to be conveniently lost in the mainstream media, I love it how they pretend to be "Neutral" and acuse both parties of having "Extreme" elements that is the force which is currently preventing a "compromise deal" from being reached.
As if caring for the fact that a Chained C.P.I. included into the Social Security Program is nothing more than a progressive benefit CUT !.. The more the Chained C.P.I. takes hold the more benefit cuts into Social Security and Medicaid and Medicare and the more Tax revenue for the I.R.S. That is the REAL reason Congress and Obama both want a chained C.P.I. included in these "Talks"...
But according to NANCY PELOSI , a Chained C.P.I. actually strenghtens Social Security !...
Anyway, being one of the so called "Extreme" parts of the democratic party, I say to president Obama, Go over the Fiscal Cliff Mr.president , John Boehner is bluffing, after december 31 the republicans in the house will agree to ANY deal that cuts Taxes for the middle class... And Democrats will be in a better position to get a deal that can include Unemployment extension and so forth...
But we have to take a DIVE first, into those unknown scary times called the NEW YEAR
Republicans are ineducable. They rely solely on belief. They get their information from Fox, Rush, Drudge, Beck et al and will not, under any circumstances, consult any other sources.
For example, I presented the text of the section of the Affordable Care Act from which the Death Panel, Kill Grandma nonsense was derived to a Republican with whom I was discussing the issue. His response was very simple. He said "no" and refused to discuss the issue further or read the text of the bill.
This was an individual who had participated in the exact kind of end of life meeting described in the bill when his father was dying.
Republicans will destroy the country. There is no way around it because they are not dealing with reality.
Senator Maddow has a nice ring to it, doesn't it. Let her know! Go to and like: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Elect-Rachel-Maddow-to-replace-John-Kerry/455307911184522. Leave a comment telling her why you want her to consider running to fill John Kerry's soon to be vacant Senate seat. Share the page with your friends on your FB newsfeed to spread the word. Maybe she would be interested if enough people let her know! Thanks.
Maybe Obama would get somewhere if he actually picked a fight.
It'd be nice if this crap stopped working on Obama. You know, if Obama would actually realize that, with a lot of people working their butts off, he won. And to stop giving away the store to these asswholes. Giving in to these jackholes after they keep doing this crap only ensures it will keep happening.
GOP newspeak requires some translation.
"picked a fight" and "poisoned the well." - these phrases clearly do not mean what you think they mean. You are trying to translate them literally, word for word, into the Democratic lexicon and that can't be done. So long as the referent is Democratic policies, the words have a distinctly axiomatic meaning for any member of the GOP who utters them. The closest translation to normal English as spoken by Democrats and other normal people is, "He refused to give us everything we wanted and self-destruct."
C'mon Nancy Pelosi -- but you are probably right in the middle of this whole thing, working hard to get this resolved.
In 2011 Obama offered the Republicans a "Grand Deal" but they said no and created the debt ceiling crisis. Now Obama has offered the Republicans a "Fair Deal" and they are saying no with a threat for another debt ceiling crisis. After January 1 Obama needs to offer the Republicans the "Raw Deal" where he gets everything he wants and Republicans get it crammed down their throats because of public opinion. Maybe the Republicans will learn a lesson. But I doubt it.