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By the time Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell turned to Vice President Biden as his new negotiating partner, one thing was clear: Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid had simply run out of counteroffers. Democrats had gone as far as they could go, and Republicans weren't willing to say, "Yes."
Just how far had Reid gone in making concessions? For one thing, the income threshold for higher rates was moved up from $250,000 to $400,000 (or depending on which insider account you believe, $450,000). For another, Democrats had also largely caved on estate taxes, raising the eligibility threshold and accepting a lower rate.
Both of these concessions, it's worth emphasizing, would mean far less deficit reduction -- the ostensible point of this exercise. The tradeoffs are a reminder that when Republicans say they're desperate to address the debt, they really don't mean it. Democratic proposals do far more to reduce the fiscal shortfall than GOP alternatives -- and Republicans are the ones who pretend to see a "debt crisis."
As if this weren't enough, Democrats were also offering to accept these terms without a debt-ceiling increase. Instead, all Dems would get in return are measures that have traditionally enjoyed bipartisan support: middle-class tax breaks, extended jobless aid, and temporary fixes on AMT and Medicare reimbursement rates.
Democrats are even prepared to postpone the sequester, a policy Republicans say they're desperate to avoid.
It's unclear why McConnell wasn't prepared to accept this overly generous package, but whatever the motivation, it's unlikely Republicans will get a better offer later in the week if the deadlines go unmet and Democratic numbers in both chambers improve.
So what more do GOP leaders hope to get out of the process? McConnell reportedly wants a $550,000 income threshold for higher rates (which would mean less deficit reduction) and lower rates on capital gains (which would mean less deficit reduction).
What's more, dealing with the sequester is proving to be surprisingly complicated.
CNN learned on Sunday from Democratic and Republican senators that Democrats at one point suggested postponing or delaying the sequester for one or two years. Republicans exiting their caucus meeting Sunday afternoon, including Snowe and Sen. Bob Corker of Tennessee indicated the idea was a non-starter with their party, largely out of fear that the sequester delay would not be offset and would add to the deficit.
It's difficult to understand exactly what Republicans are trying to do here. On the one hand, they want higher deficits by shielding the wealthy from higher tax rates, and on the other hand, they say they want lower deficits by keeping a sequester policy they simultaneously say they oppose.
One of the reasons the talks have gone so poorly is that GOP officials never actually got around to crafting a specific plan or setting clear parameters of which goals they found worthwhile.
Regardless, everything is quickly coming to a tipping point. McConnell and Vice President Biden were reportedly negotiating until midnight, and in about a half-hour, Harry Reid will reportedly come to the Senate floor and offer the political world an update, and perhaps even a roadmap of what happens next.
Update: Reid did, in fact, speak at 11, but didn't have much to report. Discussions "continue" and there are "a number of issues on which the two sides are still apart." He added, "There are still some issues that need to be resolved before we can bring legislation to the floor."
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You may make a deal, but you gotta know who you are bargaining with:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_for_the_Angels
Directed by: Robert Parrish, Written by: Rod Serling
Plot summary: A salesman, Lou Bookman, is told by Death that he is to die at midnight. Mr. Bookman argues that his life's work as a salesman is not quite complete, and convinces Death to give him enough time to give one last, great sales pitch - "a pitch for the angels", as Mr. Bookman puts it. Once Death agrees, Bookman then announces his intention to quit sales and find another line of work. He is proud of having outsmarted Death, and virtually assured of his immortality.
What Bookman hasn't counted on is that someone must die at midnight. Because of this, Death chooses one of Bookman's many young friends (a little girl who lives in the same building), who is then hit by a truck. As she lies comatose, he comes to claim her. Bookman pleads with Death to take him after all, instead of the girl, but Death is adamant; a deal is a deal. However, as they wait for the appointed time, Bookman distracts Death with a sales pitch aimed at him. Bookman is so compelling that Death is too enthralled to claim the girl, instead purchasing all of Bookman's goods. Midnight passes before Death even realizes that he has missed his appointment.
In saving the girl's life, Bookman has willingly sacrificed his own; he has now made that last great sales pitch - "one for the angels", one that could persuade even Death, thus fulfilling the original agreement. Before leaving with Death, Bookman packs up his case of wares, hopefully remarking "You never know who might need something up there." He then uncertainly asks, "Up there?" to which Death replies, "Up there, Mr. Bookman. You made it."
No deal is better than a BAD deal , start all over again in January , with out the Bush tax cuts and concentrate on getting taxes cut for the working tax payers ONLY ,
Republicans have Vowed not to work with the White House many times over , So knowing that going in gives us an edge .
Obama should use Executive Order and go around the Republican party as if they arent there . Get the things done that America needs .
The GOPers still cling to the Big Lie as their ONLY response to everything. So their strategy is to do what they want to do so badly they can taste it: cut Social Security and Medicare, but they want to do it in such a way as to blame Obama and Democrats for it.
But you'd think they might have learned from Romney/Ryan's Big Lies about Obama and Medicare: the people are no longer fooled.
Arrest and Impeach all Elected Republicans for Treason .
OK the POTUS is going to speak at 1:30 Eastern. We'll know more then!
Please insist on an immediate House vote on the clean, Senate-approved bill extending tax cuts on $250K income and below. How could they reasonably vote no?
Go over cliff and negotiate balance with newly seated gains in both chambers and 100% of the remaining revenue gained from lost Bush tax cuts (including estate, capital gains, etc.) as starting point; roughly $1.4 trillion I believe. That virtually solves our deficit problem.
Leverage defense cuts from sequester to re-target $$ toward infrastructure, education, etc., (critical investments) with goal of employing/transitioning vets and other unemployed/underemployed to fill many of these needed jobs.
Remaining sequester cuts should be immediately stopped and renegotiated in two (2) phases.
1 - cuts required only to meet near term deficit reduction goal(s)
2 - changes required to balance investment/spending needs vs. debt reduction goal(s)
The Answer to the Fiscal Cliff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1Tc1cD6FcY
This is a paradigm. Instead of thinking about only cutting expenses and only maintaining tax revenue; what not start treating the country's services as a business? Start charging for our military protection. If a country no longer wants it; we will leave and save the expense. When a country calls for our intervention; charge a fee. We should also limit foreign imports to influence the people to buy items manufactured in the United States. Think about it. There are so many other avenues to explore that will produce a monetary subsidy without harming the People. You just need to think young and smart.
I've always thought our services should be billable. Our military training services should be billable. There is a lot we do that should make money for this country-agreed! Why we still have Marines in Japan is amazing without charging for them to be there. We don't need all those WW2 bases. Unless they are a military base for a hospital for OUR GI's or our planes maintenance needs we shouldn't be there paying other countries for the "right to be there". All we need is our Navy and a few ports over seas and a few airbases. We can reach everywhere from air or sea now. Now that's my idea for cuts at Defense.
Our military should not bill person's we assist during times of war, escalated conflict, aggressive diplomatic measures, security measures, or national disaster assistance. That's terrible. We are not a nation who should profit off of wartime ventures that's just sick. Nor should we profit off of helping those in distress during disasters or other times of need. Nor should we profit off the vast security measures we take as part of a global effort for stability.
But I will say that we do not need to have a military presence in a great many of the countries we currently are in. We don't need people to be stationed in Italy, Germany, Japan, Australia, and so on. We should be closing down these military installations and bringing our service members home from unnecessary overseas bases. Now the US could make some money by selling these buildings to foreign governments sine we'd no longer be keeping our military there. And I would agree that we should sell those buildings as opposed to just hand them over to other governments like we did with that huge base in Baghdad, Iraq. At least try to get some money recouped for our presence there. That I'd be OK with.
The Answer to the Fiscal Cliff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1Tc1cD6FcY
These 'negotiations" expose the Democrats for the wolf-in-sheep's-clothing that they are. The Republicans have pointed out, again and again, that spending is the REAL reason we keep piling on the debt, not revenue. So the Democrats are getting at least some of what they want (tax increases to add revenue) but not making a single concession on cutting any spending whatsoever. We should all be happy to see the Republicans holding the Democrats feet to the fire this afternoon. We adults need to accept a few sacrifices to our favorite government programs in order to secure our children's economic future.
Please provide any evidence that debt passed on to the next generation causes harm to the next generation (nationally speaking, of course)
LOL WHAT ABOUT THE SPENDING?? Liberals NEVER discuss cutting back. Note: WE ARE BROKE!
You mean like spending on two asinine and unnecessary wars that we put on our credit card? Like a prescription drug benefit that was needed (especially for Bushie to get elected in 2004) but not only wasn't paid for, but that required that everybody in the country, including the government, overspend on pharmaceuticals? Like paying military contractors ten times what people in the service were paid to perform the same services? Like subsidizing oil companies--the most profitable firms on the face of the earth? Like cutting taxes for the nation's wealthiest individuals at a time when we were reverting to annual deficits?
Spending like that? That's the kind of spending to which you refer, right?
Although it might be horrible to go off the fiscal cliff, it's better to go off the cliff than to give in to these Republiturds. So far their only goal has been to fill the pockets of the rich and make the working, poor, and elderly pay for even being alive in America. This bull of giving these Republiturds anything when they are entirely unwilling to give anything at all, is entirely stupid. Why should the working people, the ones these Republiturds are supposed to be working FOR be penalized for the Republiturd puppeteers who want everything their way.
i did not campaign and vote to repeat the "hold unemployment hostage for bush tax cuts" game. if obama goes above $200-250,000, i am taking my vote back.... yes, i can do that and, we could make his life more miserable than mitch mcconnell could imagine.
I've said this before. It is worth repeating:
We tend to damn the GOP for breaking their word. Well, credit where credit is due: the GOP has NOT broken their word, their avowed and ultimate goal: the utter destruction Of Obama.
It is their constant motivation, their ONLY motivation and they have not deviated from it one single inch since the day they plotted their strategy on the very day, maybe, the very instant that Obama, still an unknown quantity, was being inaugurated, before the Balls, before he had stepped into the WH, the GOP began plotting.
What was known of Obama at that moment? Only three things: he was and is a brilliant speaker, he’s a Democrat and he’s Black. The last two represent for any right-winger the ultimate insult to the WH itself and the country. A BLACK PRESIDENT: an abomination of Biblical proportions.
In this and ONLY in this has the GOP kept its word.
Plotting against the President IS Treason. It is Treason against the Office, it is Treason against the Constitution they are sworn to uphold, it is Treason against the country, it is treason against the People who elected them in good faith.
The GOP campaigned on JOBS, JOBS, JOBS. They, themselves, have not created a single JOB and have opposed every bill proposed by Obama.
If plotting against the President is Treason, replacing their OWN campaign promise of JOBS, JOBS, JOBS with that Treason is, not to put a fine point to it, Treason against themselves and Perjury, the VOLUNTARY violation of their Oath of office which is to serve the People not to hold them hostage in order to achieve their ONE and ONLYgoal: the destruction of one man: Obama.
Bottom line: Treason, Perjury, Slander and Libel (whether written or spoken), thy name is GOP.
All this idiocy is not only to make Obama look bad but to punish him AND the American People for re-electing him.
Really, folks, how could you re-elect the Black Man McConnell swore to destroy? lol
Remember: "Our FIRST priority is to make him a one term President". Not, JOBS, JOBS, JOBS. That campaign promise got tossed aside and not a single job was created in 2 years.
We're going over the cliff!!! News just broke!!!
YES!!!
My pipes froze this morning. I'm breaking out the alcohol.
Sorry to hear that. I've had that happen.
We know that the only reason why The Speaker of the House called Congress back was for them to be in D.C. for the New Years Party D.C. style without the SPOUSES!!! Some drinks, drugs, hookers and a couple of Pages here and there, to ring in the new year. It was not on the behalf of the american people, heck they have had what two years to work on this,,,,
Until there are people dying in the streets from hunger and exposure -- not just men, but women and children too -- the American people won't wake up to where the real problem lies. When unemployment payments cease, when food stamps dry up, when food banks run out of food because few can contribute, then the bulk of Americans might notice a problem. Even then, they'll probably say "Both parties are just alike." They're not; this is a Republican created and controlled situation. Democrats need a truly strong leader now -- an FDR -- and there isn't one.
No, there isn't an FDR, there isn't an LBJ either. We have a president who speaks softly and carries a small stick. He's a lousy negotiator. I am glad we went over the cliff rather than give in to the GOP, however. That would be the worst outcome.
To cave in would be the worst. This way the onus is on the T-Party House members under Boehner. (Where it has always belonged).
Looks like the Democrats failed to back U.S. financial stability. They made a deal with the Republicans and that means we won't go over the cliff, but it also means our economy will continue to fall into a PIT. Forget the cliff ... we keep digging ourselves into a hole financially and no one in the government will cut enough spending or increase revenue enough to keep us from going the way of Greece! Only the cliff could have forced the spending cuts and revenue increases we need to put us on the correct economic path.