Virginia state capitol in Richmond
The first state to seriously consider changing its electoral-vote distribution method to rig future presidential elections was also the first start to formally reject the idea.
A [Virginia state] Senate panel voted Tuesday to kill a GOP plan to change the way Virginia allocates electoral college votes.
The Senate Committee on Privileges and Elections voted to bypass the bill indefinitely....The measure appeared headed for defeat after Gov. Robert F. McDonnell (R) came out against it Friday, as did two GOP senators who sit on the committee that would decide the bill's fate.
The committee vote was 11 to 4. In other words, it wasn't close.
What's more, the vote came against a backdrop of a larger campaign that appears to be imploding. Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder (R), who had expressed some tepid support for the scheme a few days ago, is now moving in the other direction, as is the state Senate's president. Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker (R) started balking yesterday, and a few hours later, the idea effectively died in Ohio.
For those concerned with the integrity of our democratic process and the fairness of American elections, the apparent collapse of the election-rigging scheme is, to be sure, welcome news. The satisfaction is not about party or ideology, but rather, about the ideals of a level playing field in which candidates and parties can engage in a competitive battle of ideas.
But stepping back and looking at this in a larger context, I'd suggest there are two broader angles to keep in mind. The first is that while the relief of the scheme's failure is understandable, it's the result of diminished expectations. After the Virginia committee vote yesterday afternoon, I saw some voting rights advocates effectively cheer, "Hooray! Republicans considered rigging a presidential election through shameless cheating, but then decided against it!"
But that's not saying much, and celebrating a decision not to do something awful is, to put it mildly, unsatisfying.
I'm reminded of an item Ezra Klein recently published about the resolution of the latest debt-ceiling crisis.
On Friday, I asked a Democratic Senate aide what he thought of the House Republicans' decision to raise the debt ceiling for three months, putting it after the sequester and the continuing resolution (which funds the government and could, if not agreed to by the end of March, lead to a government shutdown). "It's a sign of how much the bar has shifted that the prospect of 'just' a shutdown feels like a relief," he said.
Quite right. The "bar has shifted" so far that many of us are delighted, if not amazed, when Republican policymakers voluntarily agree not to crash the global economy on purpose. Our standards for success have fallen so low, we don't actually expect progress -- we instead cheer the absence of political malevolence.
I'm delighted the Republicans' election-rigging scheme is unraveling, but it's nevertheless disheartening that such a scheme was considered, debated, and endorsed by many in the first place. I don't want a political process in which Americans celebrate when something ridiculous fails to happen; I want one in which we rejoice when something worthwhile does happen.
As for the other angle, there's likely to be some debate about how, exactly, the GOP's electoral-college plan fell apart so quickly, and whether it was doomed from the start. Reasonable people can disagree, and the answer is obviously speculative, but I'm of the opinion that it failed because of the scrutiny that came when the media realized what was going on and started talking about it.
Sunlight, in this case, was a very effective disinfectant.
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"Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty." -Thomas Jefferson
And I'm old enough to realize gerrymandering, electoral college rigging, and all other Rovean/Chenneyan designs to make our nation a permanent Republican majority will not sustain liberty for me or my fellow Americans!
The Republican brand needs to wake up and smell the coffee! There's a new morning in Amreica! -Kevo
Here we have another installment of how liberals can never be happy. Most people would be gratified that a bad idea was considered and then summarily rejected in an open, democratic manner. But no, that's not enough for people that want a perfect world.
No, liberals can never be happy.
Baloney. Guilletines on the mall would have me downright giddy.
The broader point is that the lack of political terrorism should not be a cause for celebration. I am an extremely happy liberal.
Dan P serves to remind us that leftists like Stalin and Mao have killed more people than any others combined. Why is that?
Blanks. It takes the remarkable courage born of ignorance to post what you wrote.
False equivalency...just roll with it troll
Actually Shooter, The Catholic Church before, during and after this thing called The Inquisition; killed more people than any Political Figure Head you can name. And they were/are both Christians and Conservatives.
Let's see the evidence. Stalin and Mao are credited with killing tens of millions. What have you got re: the Inquisition?
http://www.scaruffi.com/politics/dictat.html
Shooter@
Stalin & Mao weren't Liberals. Please get back in your box and spare us your ignorance of Political History.
Some of us here do actually take our World History seriously.
In response to Shooter, "...how liberals can never be happy." Are you kidding? I'm still celebrating Obama's second term, and thrilled that finally we have a president who gives a god damn about the people! And I will add that if the Republican party didn't play so often on the extreme right, many of us on the left wouldn't be so far over either.
You are a good troll.
I suspect that the 'idea' was just put on hold (perhaps 3 1/2 years) until such time that it would be too late to organize an effective response.
The Crusades were much more bloody...
On Topic: I agree with the sentiment that the lack of doing something harmful is a bad reason to be happy, but it is A reason to be happy in a slowly recovering economy with increasing economic divergence...
You're a hateful dumbass. You're another anti-American hell bent on dividing our country. You are probably another one of those paranoid types that thinks "they" are com'n-ta-git-cha and is armed like a fortress, with no faith what so ever in the United States Armed Forces. Dumbass...
"Stalin and Mao are credited with killing tens of millions."
It says volumes about you, Shooter, that you give these men 'credit' for such acts.
"Stalin and Mao are credited with killing tens of millions."
Shooter . . . You asked for proof about the numbers of people killed in the Inquisitions. Do YOU have proof for the number you cite above for Stalin and Mao?
want to bet they will try again six weeks before election day
Thinking the same thing ..."curses it didn't work this way " Lets try.......
I agree. As we get closer to 2016, they'll dig these things up again.
I agree. As we get closer to 2016, they'll dig these things up again.
Then we'll just have to vote them out in 2014 before they get a chance to do that, won't we?
That is exactly what the plan is. The media glare has caused the kochroaches ( intentionally spelled ) to scurry out of sight. They will be back as soon as this attention cools. We only have to look at Voter ID changes in the rethug states and Ohio 's atty general attempting to thwart the vote right up until the day of voting. This has not gone away, but will be back in FULL force most likely after the 2014 elections. Voters we MUST stay vigilent and must get out the vote and get these rethugs out of our state houses and out of national office. That is the ONLY message they will undersand. WE the people will not stand for stolen elections.
Well, Shooter I think I'll be pretty happy when Republicans no longer have the power to (even theoretically) thwart the will of the voters by rigging elections - meaning that they will no longer have majorities in the legislatures of many swing states with Republican governors who might sign such legislation into law.
By the way, are we sure they won't still be able to rush these bills through in some midnight session just before the deadline to change the rules? It's happened before...
The same people contemplating political suicide are cutting off funding to the suicide hotline. As the 2013 hurricane season approaches, the people of the southern states better start praying for a mild season, since El Nino was deported and federal disaster assistance is a pawn to the 2014 elections. It is not too early to call your TP reps to tell them idiocy is only fun when it involves someone else.
I hate saying this because we do know it's not the rich asswipes who get elected to office who will suffer, but letting the next Southern state that has a disaster "twist slowly in the wind" for a good long while might be the message these bastards need to get.
EXCELLENT job Rachel, Ed, and the rest of team there!!! You guys sure make a HUGE difference and we appreciate it!! Where would we be without you guys? I hope you feel my appreciation for all your wonderfully talented reporting!! Thank you so much for bringing this issue to our attention to help preserve democracy!
It's not just a victory for democracy, it shows up Reince Priebus for the complete ass that he is.
Again. Or still. Seems to be an ongoing theme with Rancid. Pretty much any time he opens his mouth.
Funny, they had a chairman who actually had successes in 2010, but they dumped him for obvious anagram Reince Priebus. Wonder what it was about that previous, successful chairman that made them want to change... there has to be something...
What is the major obvious difference between Michael Steele and Reince Priebus? There's your answer about why they fired the former and kept the latter.
Don't pretend to be "fair'. If Gerrymandered districts or electoral votes went your way, you'd be all for it. If it doesn't you'd act like Occupy Wall Street mobs.
I wish fella... Thats interesting that you fear Occupy type protests, it's a sign that you are in the upper intelligence level of a group that crowds the bottom. I see leadership in your future, keep at it...
Even gerrymandered districts and changing the way states award Electoral College votes would be nothing more than bandaids on a gaping chest wound. Repubs have yet to figure out that when your ideas are so far out of the mainstream, you can only rig things so long before it just doesn't work anymore. I have yet to see a single repub leader give more than lip service to the idea that they need to do more than change the way they put out their message. In fact, it's precisely because of how well they've put out their message that has led to their defeat in the past few elections. Wise up, gang! Americans want a sane alternative to dems, one that can be responsibly conservative on fiscal matters, not Tea Party moonbat-crazy. They don't want Christian fundamentalist social conservatism. I'm a life-long liberal, and getting more liberal each year, but I recognize the fact that no one benefits when one-half of a conversation is so crazy that it becomes irrelevant. Repubs, take whatever meds will bring you back into the real world, and let's start having a coherent conversation on how to move this nation forward.
Who knows? The horse might learn to sing.
However, I myself am in the group who think that this would be a disaster for the country. Not only for the damage it does before Karma comes around with the bill, but because the inevitable backlash will also be enormously destructive to the politics of the nation. Unlike most of the Republican Party, I would not rejoice in the destruction of an opponent -- I do, however, wish for their return to sanity.
I definitely don't want to see the end of the repub party, just its current incarnation. Many years ago, I actually voted repub, as I voted for the people I thought would do the best job, no matter the party. Since 2000, however, the party has become so extreme that I could never vote for a repub. Return to sanity, show you can produce realistic policies based on facts and reality, and that you are more than the party of racism, sexism and the rich, and people will start to listen to them. In the meantime, the current party seems more like a running joke that no one respects.
Yup. Sour grapes cuz we didn't think of it first. We NEVER seem to think of the sneaky, just-this-side-of-legal stuff first. Thank goodness we can just watch the GOP and take notes.
We seem to be meandering a little bit off-topic. My point (and I do have one) relates to what kevofrombenenland said at the outset about electoral college-rigging. I'm old enough to remember when people who genuinely wanted to move towards the popular vote being more important in presidential elections sometimes mistakenly latched onto the idea of apportioning a state's electoral vote by congressional districts + 2 for the state as a whole. This was mainly because it could be accomplished without a constitutional amendment. Wiser pundits would gently say that, no, apportioning the electroral vote by congressional district could be even more undemocratic. I never fully realized what they meant until now, and the failed effort by some Republicans to do just that!
The movement to a national popular vote is 49% of the way to go into effect.
The National Popular Vote bill would guarantee the Presidency to the candidate who receives the most popular votes in all 50 states (and DC), without a constitutional amendment.
Every vote, everywhere, would be politically relevant and equal in presidential elections. No more distorting and divisive red and blue state maps. There would no longer be a handful of 'battleground' states where voters and policies are more important than those of the voters in 80% of the states that now are just 'spectators' and ignored after the conventions.
When the bill is enacted by states with a majority of the electoral votes– enough electoral votes to elect a President (270 of 538), all the electoral votes from the enacting states would be awarded to the presidential candidate who receives the most popular votes in all 50 states and DC.
The presidential election system that we have today was not designed, anticipated, or favored by the Founding Fathers but, instead, is the product of decades of evolutionary change precipitated by the emergence of political parties and enactment by 48 states of winner-take-all laws, not mentioned, much less endorsed, in the Constitution.
The bill uses the power given to each state by the Founding Fathers in the Constitution to change how they award their electoral votes for President. Historically, virtually all of the major changes in the method of electing the President, including ending the requirement that only men who owned substantial property could vote and 48 current state-by-state winner-take-all laws, have come about by state legislative action.
In Gallup polls since 1944, only about 20% of the public has supported the current system of awarding all of a state's electoral votes to the presidential candidate who receives the most votes in each separate state (with about 70% opposed and about 10% undecided). Support for a national popular vote is strong among Republicans, Democrats, and Independent voters, as well as every demographic group in virtually every state surveyed in recent polls in recent closely divided Battleground states: CO – 68%, FL – 78%, IA 75%, MI – 73%, MO – 70%, NH – 69%, NV – 72%, NM– 76%, NC – 74%, OH – 70%, PA – 78%, VA – 74%, and WI – 71%; in Small states (3 to 5 electoral votes): AK – 70%, DC – 76%, DE – 75%, ID – 77%, ME – 77%, MT – 72%, NE 74%, NH – 69%, NV – 72%, NM – 76%, OK – 81%, RI – 74%, SD – 71%, UT – 70%, VT – 75%, WV – 81%, and WY – 69%; in Southern and Border states: AR – 80%, KY- 80%, MS – 77%, MO – 70%, NC – 74%, OK – 81%, SC – 71%, TN – 83%, VA – 74%, and WV – 81%; and in other states polled: AZ – 67%, CA – 70%, CT – 74%, MA – 73%, MN – 75%, NY – 79%, OR – 76%, and WA – 77%. Americans believe that the candidate who receives the most votes should win.
The bill has passed 31 state legislative chambers in 21 states with 243 electoral votes. The bill has been enacted by 9 jurisdictions with 132 electoral votes - 49% of the 270 necessary to go into effect.
NationalPopularVote
Follow National Popular Vote on Facebook via NationalPopularVoteInc
Now would be a silly time to do it, for one. As I'm sure Snyder reminded them, the best time would be in a lame-duck session as close as possible to the election.
And for all we know, that's the reason they put this plan on ice.
they thought they could do this in the dead of night.
"...I'm of the opinion that it failed because of the scrutiny that came when the media realized what was going on and started talking about it."
I'm with you. As a nation we've lowered our standards especially when it comes to politicians. Just think rather than voting those treasonous politicians out of office because of their incompetence, ineptitude, obstinacy in carrying out the people's business - the American people keep returning these traitors to US all back to office! We cheer because they "didn't trash the economy" with their economic terrorist tactics, not because they actually you know passed meaningful legislation!
These jokers "work" what 3 days a week and are paid a decent 6 figure salary for their obstruction - that's way overpayment considering that they do NOTHING except preen & whine before the media! Hell the people standing on the unemployment lines are more productive than Congress has been! And simply because the state legislatures aren't passing more voter disenfranchisement laws right now, WE still must keep the pressure on - cause they aren't finished by a long shot!
The hypocrisy of the GOP never fails to amaze me. Back in 2000, the GOP, mainly through the rantings of Limbaugh, was seriously considering elimination of the Electoral College system and going with only the popular vote to determine a winner in the presidential election.
Limbaugh 'warned' his listeners that he was certain that GWB would get the majority of votes, but that Al Gore 'could and may win' by winning the most electoral college votes.
Funny how that worked out, isn't it?
Thanks Rachel, you were the Paul Revere on this issue!
People WAKE THE F#CK UP! The GOP will implement this gerrymandering of the electoral college a few months before the 2016 election. They are only backing off now because it would allow too much time to over turn their deception. Just like with voter registration laws and trying to disenfranchise as many as they could. Besides, a lot of the politicians are facing elections of their own before 2016. Once they get past those elections this will be revisited with a vengeance.
No way... They would get the DOJ in their grill if they tried that right before the election.
Just a friendly notice of a typo: "The first state to seriously consider changing its electoral-vote distribution method to rig future presidential elections was also the first
startstate to formally reject the idea."It is said that character can be described as, 'how you behave when no one is watching'. Wouldn't it be nice if our elected officials bought into that concept?
Sunshine is always an effective disinfectant. Perhaps the most effective. However, that doesn't mean the shenanigans won't continue; they'll just continue in the shady shadows and backrooms where the public and press do not see.
The Republican party is in crisis. It is a crisis of epic proportions. Their leaders have forgotten what the rules of ethical behavior are. They have forgotten what integrity is in their race to power. They need to return to their roots...all the way to Abraham Lincoln, and rededicate themselves to a code of conduct which is becoming of a civilized and ethical leader of their respective constituencies.
That we have diminished expectations is our own fault. We, as a people (the American people), regardless of party affiliation (or lack thereof) need to take back our government and make those who "serve" the servants once again, rather than the masters. We need to hold them accountable for their actions (and their shenanigans).
It says much that the longer-serving members of the Republican leadership even find these schemes repugnant. The Republican leadership at both the State and Federal levels (and possibly at the more local levels ) has gone off the rails and they need to be recalled to accountability by those who put them in power in the first place.
"All just power is derived from the consent of the governed." -- John Locke
IMHO, the real reason for the retreat on the electoral rigging came from small, red states who realize that the election of a President who lost the popular vote by a large measure but came to office because of this kind of rigging, would doom the EC. These States are already over-represented (on a representative/person basis) in the House and especially in the Senate.
Do we have a clear trail leading back to the genius that came up with this plan? Sounds a lot like an ALEC-type of program.
I *love* Rachel Maddow, but this seems like an example of her being a little dishonest.
Concern troll alert... If what you claim is true about those folks electing Republicans at the state level simply accepting a cheat scheme like this, we would have the cheat schemes. The truth is these state reps know they would eat crowburgers in the next election if they try this. You just want these people to sacrifice themselves, but they are politicians, so survival is their agenda...
An example of congressional district gerrymandering effects, in 2012, is that Virginia Republicans got 51% of U.S. House of Representatives vote, but won 73% of seats!
Maine and Nebraska use the congressional district method. Maine and Nebraska voters support a national popular vote.
A survey of Maine voters showed 77% overall support for a national popular vote for President.
In a follow-up question presenting a three-way choice among various methods of awarding Maine’s electoral votes,
* 71% favored a national popular vote;
* 21% favored Maine’s current system of awarding its electoral votes by congressional district; and
* 8% favored the statewide winner-take-all system (i.e., awarding all of Maine’s electoral votes to the candidate who receives the most votes statewide).
***
A survey of Nebraska voters showed 74% overall support for a national popular vote for President.
In a follow-up question presenting a three-way choice among various methods of awarding Nebraska’s electoral votes,
* 60% favored a national popular vote;
* 28% favored Nebraska’s current system of awarding its electoral votes by congressional district; and
* 13% favored the statewide winner-take-all system (i.e., awarding all of Nebraska’s electoral votes to the candidate who receives the most votes statewide).
&&&&
Republican legislators who want to split state electoral votes in states that have recently voted Democratic in presidential elections, do not want to split electoral votes in states that recently voted Republican in presidential elections.
Dividing more states’ electoral votes by congressional district winners would magnify the worst features of the Electoral College system.
If the district approach were used nationally, it would be less fair and less accurately reflect the will of the people than the current system. In 2004, Bush won 50.7% of the popular vote, but 59% of the districts. Although Bush lost the national popular vote in 2000, he won 55% of the country's congressional districts.
The district approach would not provide incentive for presidential candidates to campaign in a particular state or focus the candidates' attention to issues of concern to the state. With the 48 state-by-state winner-take-all laws (whether applied to either districts or states), candidates have no reason to campaign in districts or states where they are comfortably ahead or hopelessly behind. In North Carolina, for example, there are only 2 districts (the 13th with a 5% spread and the 2nd with an 8% spread) where the presidential race is competitive. Nationwide, there have been only 55 "battleground" districts that were competitive in presidential elections. With the present deplorable 48 state-level winner-take-all system, 80% of the states (including California and Texas) are ignored in presidential elections; however, 88% of the nation's congressional districts would be ignored if a district-level winner-take-all system were used nationally.
Awarding electoral votes by congressional district could result in third party candidates winning electoral votes that would deny either major party candidate the necessary majority vote of electors and throw the process into Congress to decide.
Because there are generally more close votes on district levels than states as whole, district elections increase the opportunity for error. The larger the voting base, the less opportunity there is for an especially close vote.
Also, a second-place candidate could still win the White House without winning the national popular vote.
A national popular vote is the way to make every person's vote equal and matter to their candidate because it guarantees that the candidate who gets the most votes in all 50 states and DC becomes President.
Totally agree with some others above. They are shelving this temporarily. I read somewhere a quote from a VA delegate, saying the "timing" wasn't right for this. It leaves a bad "impression." Whadya think? They haven't given up.
Timing is everything and in their "minds" there is a time when we will be ready to either submit to such crap or they will be made dictators.
Nope... the only time this would work is way before an election, like right now. They dipped their toes in the water, now they have decided they like their jobs...
The "timing wasn't right" because people like Rachel dug into it and made it a point to shine a light on what those Republican legislators were up to. Then, the national media got a hold of it and lots of people took notice.
The "timing will be right" when they think the media are distracted or have lost interest in watching over what they do.
Damn liberal media shining lights into dark chambers! Why can't you leave these arrogant losers alone? I mean first you show voter ID for what it is then you tell the people all about this attempt to redistrict in a crazy quilt fashion sewn by what appears to be the KKK quilting bee!
I hope they can move on and rise to the level of their responsibilities.